Infosys Attacks Whistleblower in Wake of Senate Testimony

Don Tennant

In a response to the damning testimony that Infosys employee and whistleblower Jay Palmer presented to a Senate subcommittee hearing on immigration reform yesterday, Infosys has released a statement claiming that the testimony was untruthful, and denied that the company has mistreated Palmer.

 

In my post yesterday, "Infosys Whistleblower Provides Hard-hitting Testimony to Senate Hearing," I quoted extensively from Palmer's testimony. You can't read it without being blown away by the flagrancy and insidiousness of Infosys' alleged violations, so it's unsurprising that Infosys felt backed into a corner and needed to lash out. According to a report on NDTV Profit, a media outlet in India, this was the response:

In its response, Infosys today said that Jay Palmer's commentary to the Senate was full of exaggerations and falsehoods. The company said that Palmer wanted to advance his objective of getting a big payout from the company and there was no strategy to circumvent the H-1B visa programme. Palmer's complaints to the company had been handled in compliance with the law and Infosys did not retaliate or mistreat Palmer in any way, a statement by the company said.

As an aside, the NDTV Profit article referred to Palmer as a "former Infosys employee," which is a mistake. Palmer is still an employee of Infosys. In any case,

this is the first time I'm aware of that Infosys has accused Palmer of being untruthful. It makes me wonder whether the company is fully aware of all the evidence that Palmer and his attorney have in their possession. I would love to see Infosys' executives questioned under oath and compelled to identify what it was in Palmer's testimony that was an exaggeration or a falsehood. I would also love to see the looks on their faces when Palmer's attorney presents that evidence, including evidence of retaliation against and mistreatment of Palmer. Bottom line, this was a very ill-advised statement for Infosys to have released to the press. Wearing my hat as a partner in QVerity, a company that does training and consulting in detecting deception, I can tell you that attacking the accuser is a classic behavioral indicator of deception, and is typically seen when the accused feels particularly pressured by the facts of the case.

 

In a separate "What were they thinking?" development, you have to give Infosys the chutzpah award of the year. At a time when the U.S. government is conducting a multi-agency criminal investigation of Infosys stemming from Palmer's allegations, Infosys is making a concerted effort to increase its presence in the government sector in the United States, and by extension, to get more money from U.S. taxpayers.

 

According to a report on Livemint.com, a media partner of The Wall Street Journal, Infosys Public Services (IPS), the Infosys arm that targets state and federal government business, is taking steps to ramp up its operations in the United States. Here's an excerpt:

[IPS] is looking to hire about 800 people this fiscal year, including around 300 for its development centre in Texas, IPS chief executive Eric Paternoster said. The centre has already hired about 200 people in the past few quarters. The bulk of Bangalore-headquartered Infosys' revenue comes from the US corporate world. US government spending on information technology (IT) presents a neglected but addressable market for the firm. Currently, only 2-3% of North American revenue for Infosys comes from direct or indirect work for the US government, Paternoster said. For the June quarter, 64% of Infosys' $1.6 billion revenue came from the US.

 

"Government spending accounts for a third of all IT spending worldwide," Paternoster said in a phone interview from the US on Monday. "While we have been doing work for the government, it has been in an ad-hoc, non-focused manner." Infosys set up the subsidiary in October 2009, training an eye specifically on this market. US revenue for Infosys grew 5.1% in the June quarter over the preceding three months. "From a small base, we expect to grow much faster than the group overall," Paternoster said. The theoretical addressable market for Infosys in the US government sector is about $2 billion, he estimated. "Of that, there is a $500 million space which we can focus on." ... IPS will focus on deals related to civilian technologies.

Here's the kicker:

Paternoster said while many government agencies seek on-site work to preserve US jobs, he expects cost pressures to push many of them to consider the offshoring model as well. He sees an equal mix of onshore and offshore deals for IPS eventually in terms of revenue.

How's that for chutzpah?



Add Comment      Leave a comment on this blog post
Jul 27, 2011 2:27 AM VM VM  says:

Don, looks like you have a problem if Infosys hires American nationals... I read the complete statement from Jay and to me there is a bit of exaggeration similar to your title that sensationalises anything and everything. While I do not endorse what Infosys is saying, I would rather be neutral like prof. Ron Hira's report taking a look at the macro environment rather than just this situation. Like I said earlier, you are only creating a feel good environment for people to come and read what they would like to hear and keep fighting with each other without constructively thinking about what is needed to fix the problem.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:32 AM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says:

Jay Palmer has lost income, his career is on hold, and Infosys has now besmirched his character.  There are certainly damages and he is entitled to his day in court to seek a fair settlement.

I personally hope Jay gets a payday because it's one more tool to punish companies for bad behavior.  They don't do the right thing unless the wrong thing costs them money.  This is how we punish entities that we can't toss in prison.

The statement by Infosys may make CEOs feel good about themselves and be a form of anger management, but I think Jay's attorney just heard cash registers going off.  Not a smart legal move by Infosys.  For a billion dollar company, they just made a mom and pop business mistake.

Wondering why the error on Jay being a "former" employee.  That's a pretty big mistake for a reporter to make.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:34 AM Chamat Chamat  says:

This blog is written assuming Palmer has won the case and everything said by him is proved correct in the court whereas in my understanding it still not proven. Also I didnot find any chutzpah in Paternoster's statement of condidering offshoring model for cast effectiveness.

In the end I wonder whats the base of this blog!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:42 AM Don Tennant Don Tennant  says: in response to VM

I've seen the evidence. They have a treasure trove of evidence. You tell me: On what do you base your statement that there is a bit of exaggeration in Jay's testimony? What, specifically, is he exaggerating about?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:44 AM Su Su  says: in response to VM

As Ranga or Sara mentioned in past - these are such a small and easy to prove matter that it should not be subject of debate.

Death threat etc can be tracked within minutes and proved rather than doing investigations on it for months. So either of them can be guilty. We should concentrate on much bigger issues. It is clear that Palmer has much more bigger agenda than just some fraud. He is more concerned about entire system job loss etc and about US economy going down but still Infosys, Tata making profit etc.

He should have not joined a business which is all about offshoring and outsourcing. He has a bigger battle to fight than just finding out some fraud. However nothing wrong in Don giving his personal opinion. That is what blogging all about. What's wrong if he doesn't support something and be vocal about it. Wrong will be if Don starts supporting Infosys if they offer something to him - which to some extent Palmer did. He has totally against the idea of outsourcing and offshoring with grudge against it - then why did he join Infosys in the first place. These silly comments of threat etc are just to get silly attention. Don knows Linkedin contacts who gave constant death threats so cops should be on their way to arrest those guys and then prove whether those are Infosys sponsored or not.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:46 AM Chamat Chamat  says: in response to Don Tennant

Problem lies in identifying something as peice of eveidence. Its not necessary that what you think as an evidence is actually an evidence in the court.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:47 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says:

Infosys must be really believing their own NDTV press that "all is well". As this drags on, there is every chance a few more Infosys employees may break from the fold and join the Palmer case. If that happens then it is definitely going to be a complete disaster for Infosys' defense in court.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:53 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to Su

You are conflating "outsourcing" and "breaking the law". Funny how even you being Indian make that association. Palmer's case is not about the legality of outsourcing. It is about the legality of Infosys' business practices.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 2:55 AM chm chm  says: in response to Chamat

Yeah the 'evidence'!!!.... the similar way he thinks him as "journalist" and his words as "reports". and he was cry baby other day because patricia "reported" before her. Why are you spoiling fun here ?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:01 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says:

I think all of us Palmer supporters should mail a big box of bright red whistles to each of Infosys' US offices. ! Now wouldn't that be a message to send !!!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:05 AM Su Su  says: in response to SealTeam6

NO - actually you want to change the law. No one is breaking the law. Your target should be changing the law. That is what entire agenda should be.

You can be very happy just keep shouting everyone is fraud - but that is not going to do any good. Palmer might win this case which is good small step but at no point it will be proved that entire Infosys is doing fraud and planning to kill people.

It is just some kiddish sentiment which can make your day happy and nothing else.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:13 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to Su

When you say "no one is breaking the law"..  can you elaborate ? Are you familiar with the intricacies of the visa law that Infosys has run afoul of ? 

Knowing what I know about how business is conducted in India and what "baksheesh" means in that part of the world and how the society is geared to run smoothly on such palm greasing, I am aware that the concept of law as it stands in the West is not the same in all parts of the world. Perhaps we have a cultural misunderstanding here ?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:14 AM chm chm  says: in response to SealTeam6

Yes. That will be very nice small baby step towards doing something different and getting a life rather than what you do 24*7 now.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:16 AM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says: in response to Su

"He should have not joined a business which is all about offshoring and outsourcing. "

There are plenty of people who supported outsourcing and offshoring, the H-1b, L-1, and other job killing programs like NAFTA and later learned that there wasn't much to like.

They drank the Kool-aid.  They spit it out. 

Did Jay have any reasonable expectation that the company he worked for would ask him to defraud the government?  I think not.  I have opposed Infosys' hiring practices for years, but not even I knew that they were engaged in systemic immigration fraud.  I was looking for something to dislike about them, and I didn't discover that very ugly aspect.  Why would Jay have reason to believe that if even their political adversaries didn't know?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:17 AM Su Su  says: in response to SealTeam6

Ok, sorry I can't keep on elaborating and drag discussion towards where you want to go. You win!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:22 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to chm

Oooh... you sound upset.... why is that ? Something I said ?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:24 AM Su Su  says: in response to R. Lawson

I have a feeling that they know everything.

It is not that Jay or Ron Hira is enlightening anyone here in USCIS or Gov.

I can't digest that "they" are so innocent.

Unless they are ready to change system - such reports are not going to help anything and that is why I'm not that excited.

You mentioned somewhere when economy is going good no one listens to these things. Now it is not going good - it is high time that some concrete action is taken. But again when it improves it is very difficult to design a protectionist policy you dream of.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 3:42 AM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says: in response to Su

"You mentioned somewhere when economy is going good no one listens to these things. Now it is not going good - it is high time that some concrete action is taken. But again when it improves it is very difficult to design a protectionist policy you dream of."

Exactly why I think of all times, now is the best time to have the immigration debate.  Labor will have more sway.  If I'm being accused of being practical: guilty as charged.

I don't believe the economy will improve unless there is more artificial stimulus driven by more debt.  Free traders can "fake it" by printing more money or encouraging Americans to accumulate more personal debt.  The house of cards will eventually fall - and actually are falling as we speak.  I don't think we can spend our way out of this and buy more time - although our government and the banks certainly are trying to do just that.

Free trade does not work.  There will be no recovery.  This is the "new normal".  We either change and adapt or we accept our inevitable decline.  We accept that we will leave our country is worse shape for our children than our parents left it for us.

It's not that I want a "protectionist utopia".  It's that our current consumer (debt) driven model is running out of steam.  People can only take on so much debt.  Because of falling housing prices, they now have less money to play with (less debt they can accumulate).

I want what works.  It's not that I am in love with "protectionism".  It's that deficits are not sustainable long term.  Our country has been hijacked by corporate interests and their interests don't include the long-term prosperity of the American people.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 4:48 AM Ron Ron  says:

I think the whole Infosys episode started due to the fact that they were sending their employees on B-1 (/B-2) visas that primarily is for business visits, tourism, meetings for executives et al.and that as part of the USCIS regulations personnel on B-1 is not supposed to work for the customer and things of that nature.The number of comments that came in kind of twisted and turned the story in such a way that everyone forgot about the B-1 issue and moved in to H1B which indeed is meant for work and is legal to that end.

Firstly, I would like to mention that on B-1 visa none can stay beyond the 6 months timeframe and many at the port of entry in the USA would be stamped for 3 months.Given that, those set of people can never replace a long-standing 'American' worker.On the other hand, bringing in H1B employees on board to replace the 'American' workers while true does not yield the (H1B) sponsoring company nor the client any major profit margins.

We need to understand the bottomline for organizations here and everywhere in the world is to make a profit and thence the subsequent activity of replacing a high paid employee or resource comes in to play.That being said, with a H1B employee the sponsoring company like Infosys can only quote a dollar amount that is a few hundred dollar less than what is being paid to an 'American' worker and the organizations that are looking to outsource would rather continue with the existing workforce.

The financial dynamics is such that the US organizations are relieved of owning an employee on their payroll handle their benefits package et al.that the Indian IT outsourcing partners are willing to take up for their 'India' employees and sponsor their H1B and what not.That is one side of the coin, the other side is for the sponsoring company like Infosys cannot go on with their H1B business and make tiny profits.

The key word is offshoring.The Indian IT outsourcing companies make money by replacing the US organization's workforce in India not by leveraging the H1Bs.An Indian rupee equals 0.022 cents of the US currency given that, they can charge the customer probably $40 per hour that will given them enough leeway to pay their employee in India and take care of their benefits and manage the salary hike for the future and the whole nine yards.

I sincerely regret what this offshoring has done to the IT jobs at the same time, the US organizations have been able to move their employees that are retained in their organization to next level where they can concentrate on business critical and IT process improvements.Again, there are 2 sides of the coin - Good and bad of offshoring.

Also, I kindly would like to mention that lashing out Indian IT organizations does not get us anywhere.Think about the holistic perspective of what the US organizations also want.I am sure they also know how the H1B thingy operates and has been operating so far yet they wanted cheap labor and for every 1 H1B cost they pay the Infosyss or the Cognizants and the TCSs, 10 is paid at an offshore rate to those Indian IT organizations.In essence, if they pay $10 for a H1B employee of the sponsoring organization, they get to pay the same $10 for the rest 9 employees at offshore which by and large is a lucrative one and makes business sense for the US organizations.In other words, they can replace 10 employees of the US organization with 1 employee on H1B and 9 employees in India given them (US organization) a gain on the benefits package that carry on their shoulders if it were their own employees. Reply

Jul 27, 2011 4:48 AM Ron Ron  says:
Most importantly, by offshoring, until the recent bill was passed to pay offshore taxes, the US organizations were having a great time avoiding those taxes and that was a big cost saver too (for the US organizations).

It also brings up a point that US organizations and the Indian IT organizations are hand-n-glove to make money in the process.The system should be blamed not just one organization that hails from a specific country just because the workforce and their contribution while miniscule compared to the total percentage of job losses in this country is blown out of proportion.I mean of the 10.5% unemployment percentage, may I say about 0.5% only is IT?Wouldnt the US organizations that are for outsourcing and/or offshoring also be answerable to this situation we have in place?

BTW, I do have to let you know that Infosys, cognizant, HCL or TCS all started small in an apartment or a car garage just like a Google or Apple or Microsoft.Let's not forget the fact that everyone has travelled miles to get where they are and I am sure organizations are operated by humans and not robots that dont have a heart to see what is going on.By crime or fraud or deceit no organization can grow bigger even if they did, it would face a debacle in no time.One might quote Enron and think about how soon it was on its knees-5 years or 8 years?The Indian IT organization that mentioned above are already 20-25 years old-FYI.

My view point is just to stay course on what the agenda is - To blame the system of how offshoring works and how the constituency around the USCIS visa propositions were created and how they were updated over the years.Blaming Infosys on things like tax evasion, fraudulent or criminal is something I do not think is correct or the right way to approach this problem.Such things will only flare up hue and cry, enable some to take out their anger on this and come up with rampant misinterpretations and minsinformed in the process.

I am not talking about anyone in person neither about your blog, I am only talking about how it comes across to the general public in which every individual has the right to their thoughts, opinions and interpretations.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 4:58 AM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says: in response to Ron

" Blaming Infosys on things like tax evasion, fraudulent or criminal is something I do not think is correct or the right way to approach this problem. "

But that is what they are accused of doing.  Although the problem isn't solved once "Infosys is punished" I think that punishing Infosys will go a long way to make companies think twice before they break the law.

This isn't a 2-dimensional issue that can be summarized into a visa type, trade practice, violation of the law, or corporate culture.  It is all of the above, and more.  We can debate which problem is the most pressing, but at the end of the day they are all problems.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 5:36 AM VM VM  says: in response to Don Tennant

Don, i am not sure as to what evidence you have seen and if that it is evidence at all, like the other day in 60 minutes they showed some guideline document. Every form filling is associated with a help everywhere. Jay has said that Infosys brought workers on B1 to do work. Also workers are temporary. At the port of entry in the last 3 years B1 is not given more than 45 days and return tickets are validated.

Here is what USCIS says:

B-1 IN LIEU OF H-1B

Any person holding a B1 or B1/B2 visa may be eligible to perform H-1B work in the United States as long as they fulfill the following criteria:

Hold the equivalent of a U.S. bachelor's degree

Plan to perform H-1B-caliber work or training

Will be paid only by their foreign employer, except reimbursement of incidental travel costs such as housing and per diem. The employee must not receive any salary from a U.S. source.

The task can be accomplished in a short period of time.

These travelers would be admitted as B1 visitors, and may only stay in the U.S. for the time allotted by the Department of Homeland Security upon entry.

Also companies pay tax on income and when employer pays per diem and remuration in the foreign currency where is question of anyone paying taxes. Basic mis-understading of how taxation works.

Further he said that the company was finding innovative way of resolving H1B restrictions. This is a fair statement for anyone to make. No one as I can recall made a statement that they will do fraud to circumvent the system.

There is other one where there is flooding of applications leading to lesser scrutiny and people can get through easily. It is not the case. Anyone who has gone through visa process for any country would realize the dilligence that is done. Also unskilled workers are brought in. Well consulates do not issue B1 visa to anyone. It is scrutinized thoroughly.

If I can ask what are the pieces of evidence that you have seen that has convinced you so much so that you are judgemental that Infosys is guilty.

The comment from Ron is very good. Look at the issue not at fixating things and making ourselves feel good that we are beating on a big gorilla!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 5:37 AM VM VM  says: in response to Ron

Well said Ron. Stay on course of the problem!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 6:23 AM Richard Richard  says: in response to Su

Well breaking immigration rules of foreign countries to make profits - if that is what you call outsourcing then your dear Infosys is in trouble. I am hoping that the senators look into this case at the earliest without further delay and announce the verdict. Lets see if Palmer wins or Infosys wins. Had this situation been in India ; Jay would have been murdered by now. Thankfully he is in the US so atleast he can make his allegations, whether true or false. And thankfully Infosys also can buy time to look into the matter and fight the allegations.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 7:06 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says: in response to Su

What started it was InfoSys decided to flood the local U.S. mission with thousands of B-1 Visa requests.  InfoSys didn't want to pay the high fees, recently placed on H-1b dependent companies.

InfoSys had many rejections for these B-1 visas, and needed someone to lie about what these employees were doing in the United States.

Lying to a federal official can be a crime, lying on a federal form is perjury.  All of which can wind up being felony offenses in the United States.  A felony offense will cost you tens of thousands of dollars to fight, and when you lose, you will have that felony on your record (for any future employer to see) for the rest of your life.

If you read Jay's statement, you'll see that Jay tried to fix the problem from the inside of InfoSys, 6+ months.  It didn't work.  Jay realized that he was, inadvertently, involved because several the workers that he managed were here illegally. 

When Jay realized that, he had no choice but to report it to Federal authorities, or risk being an accompliss to Federal crimes of Tax evasion, visa Fraud, and perjury.

He did the right thing. 

The big pay-out just isn't there.  It is not a real motivator in this case.  Here Jay probably can only get his fair compensation.  At best that's a few thousands dollars.

If Jay hadn't reported it, he risked being criminally proscecuted if the Feds became aware of the problem.

The big-money here, is the massive TAX-EVASION by InfoSys, that could easily amount tens of millions of dollars.  If found to be industry-wide, could be several hundred million dollars.

Hey the mob will kill you for a 100$ dollar drug deal, what do you think the mob would do if that were several million dollars?

Can you spell "deli sandwich"?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 7:09 AM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says: in response to jake_leone

"What started it was InfoSys decided to flood the local U.S. mission with thousands of B-1 Visa requests.  InfoSys didn't want to pay the high fees, recently placed on H-1b dependent companies."

I'm not sure how many Infosys was able to get through the system, but let's take the 7000 number.  That would save them $14M dollars in avoiding H-1b fees.

Of course there is a simple solution.  $2000 fee for Indian companies to sponsor a B-1 visa   If you can't beat them, tax them.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 7:18 AM VM VM  says: in response to jake_leone

Not sure how you got the information. I saw prof. Hira's report and the number of B1s filed by Infosys seems to be way less than the thousands claimed by you. Also can you please elaborate on the tax evasion concept. I fail to understand the same.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 7:20 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to Richard

No one as I can recall made a statement that they will do fraud to circumvent the system.

I am sure that neither did a lot of people now serving time in various prisons. The law decided otherwise.

Having served on a jury not too long ago, I can say this: They will call in expert witnesses from the DOL and USCIS to scrutinize the documents that Infosys filed for the visas. It should be pretty easy for the them to figure out whether deliberate fraud was committed. This is one aspect of the case. In addition there is  Palmer's own testimony of what he found. It will be up to the jury to decide whether the combined information and testimony holds up. Right now another company, Blackwater now known as Xe is also facing the fallout of a whistleblower's efforts to reveal their wrong doings. So this isn't a lone incident of one company being picked on under US law.

Seems like it will be a case that one way or another will set some kind of precedent in various areas, visa regulations, international business, whistle blowing etc.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 7:34 AM SS SS  says: in response to VM

I am waiting to see Don's response on your points.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 8:20 AM VM VM  says: in response to SealTeam6

Palmer's testimony will not be held up for decision making as he is the plaintiff. He would have to have witnesses to substantiate the arguement. Its hard for me to believe that Jury will be just go with the testimony from Palmer. Expert from USCIS has already certified the documents and that is how they got the visas. The question is not about forging documents here if you read the case properly!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 8:23 AM TruePatriot TruePatriot  says:

I wouldn't surprise me if Infy bribed congress and they get what they want.  We all know the Obama regime is totally corrupt.  He has probably already signed secret deals with them to ship millions of jobs overseas.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 8:24 AM Don Tennant Don Tennant  says: in response to VM

Obviously there is a lot I have seen that I have agreed to keep off the record. Keep in mind that a civil trial is pending and a criminal investigation is ongoing here. Do you really think Palmer and his attorney would make the allegations they have made if they couldn't prove them? Do you think for one moment that Palmer would perjure himself in testimony before a subcomittee of the U.S. Senate, and that his attorney would ever allow that to happen? Think about it.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 8:26 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to VM

Jay Palmer says there is evidence that InfoSys employees brought in under B-1, actually worked at clients sites in the United States.

InfoSys therefore committed at least 2 acts of tax evasion, and 1 count of fee evasion in each case:

- Failure to withhold income taxes due on the employees pay

- Failure to pay the employee minimum wages (many of these employees were being paid sub-minum wage) and with holding federal income tax due on that money.

- Bringing in employees under the B-1 visa to work, Visa Fraud in order to avoid 2000$ per visa fee due under a proper visa, in this case the H-1b visa.

Additionally, they used the B-1 visa as a tax, wage, and fee shelter, as more properly these workers should have been paid the prevailing wage.  And additional taxes are also due on that prevailing wage.

And, apparently, InfoSys has been doing this for years.  Jay Palmer didn't realize he was managing several employees (from the beginning of his tenure at InfoSys in 2008) that were also fraudulently brought in under B-1 visas, when they should have been brought in under the H-1b.

Just read the statement given by Jay Palmer, submitted as Congressional testimony.  There is no financial motivation for Jay to submit this testimony.  Indeed, he is subject to the same perjury condition of the other witnesses brought in, so he must have (and had better have) evidence that backs his sworn statements.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 8:39 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to VM

UCSIS has been ridiculously sloppy in with the Visa Programs.

Several times audits have found the following problems:

- More than 1-in-5 H-1b visa holders had obtained their visa fraudulently.

- Cannot even make a clear statement on the numbers of Visa (H-1b, B-1, or L-1) issued

- Workers not under the control of company that holds the visa, in fact several times the employee was on the other side of the country, working a completely different job.

- Workers not being paid or being benched for several months, brought in under H-1b, and told to find a job in the United States .

- Workers brought in as sex-workers, only found after local police discovered they were prostitutes.

UCSIS does not have the resources to actually review a tenth of the forms submitted.  Given their actual official history in this area, I don't think their testimony would be worth anything.

This is why InfoSys was able to game the system, and indeed did attempt to flood the consulate with Visa applications (for which there is no dispute).

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:00 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to VM

The documents from the USCIS are based on the information that Infosys provided to obtain them. If the information provided was fraudulent, then the visas are invalid.

Anyway, if you are so confident about Palmer's case being thrown out, why do you sound worried. Guess there is no worry for Infosys either. After all it is the word of one person (so far) against a multi-billion corporation...  To quote from Shakespeare "So are they all, all honorable men" at Infosys ... no ?

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:11 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says:

An interesting poll conducted among Indian businesses:

Equitymaster, India's first finance website, just concluded its poll on India's Most Trustworthy Group. The objective was to find out which corporate entity does the Indian investor trust the most in these days of scams and scandals.2,671 readers participated in this poll to vote for the Group that they believed was the most credible and transparent in reporting its financial statements such as Annual reports, and Quarterly results.The poll included Groups such as Infosys, HDFC, Tata, TVS, Anil Ambani Group, Mukesh Ambani Group, L&T, ICICI, Bharti Airtel and Aditya Birla Group.With a huge majority of 61.21% votes, the Tata Group emerged as the clear winner. Others such as HDFC and ICICI trailed far behind. Infosys came a distant second with barely 16.85%.Surprisingly, despite the 2G scam, the popularity of the Tatas seemed unaffected. However, the same could not be said for Infosys whose popularity seems to have taken a hit.

www.businesswireindia.com/PressRelease.asp?b2mid=27661

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:16 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

I am 100% confident no one other than Palmer has any credibility with courage to join him. It is easier said than done...first anyone raise a fraud case against a multi-billion dollar company needs enormous amount of credibility with unlimited amount of courage to speak up.

Mostly you will find such a person 1 in million and that one....fortunately Infosys got in their payroll.

To my heart I feel this case will be easily settled by Infosys with their big pay check for talented lawyers (good example Casey Anthony's case...it was really breath taking verdict...after that case I lost any hope on justice system..all you need is best lawyer..then you are free from any wrong doing). All you need is best lawyer(s) and good bank balance to handle the case.

Like Chamat says...Palmer lawyer has big task of proving all the evidence he has to be credible one and make sure the jury buys their version of story.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:22 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

And what kind of law was followed when Casey Anthony was freed from guilty ? She lost her daughter for 30 days...never reported to anyone (family, police, friends...etc)...never stopped partying (don't have to describe the kind of parties she went on)....lied to every possible person to distract them from getting into any sort of conclusion...

And after long trial with live telecast (you should have see her laughing...don't know for what reason she would laugh...in the court)...verdict was simply not guilty and adding to that State government has to pay her lawyer fees (just few millions...)...because she was broke and having no money....now she is getting protection and living expenses at the cost of tax payers.

In any country all it takes is money and good lawyers to get out of any mess.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:26 AM Su Su  says: in response to R. Lawson

"Of course there is a simple solution.  $2000 fee for Indian companies to sponsor a B-1 visa   If you can't beat them, tax them."

You can't hit them much this way. All will happen is it will bring down their profit margin. However they will still continue the same game. If you make H1 minimum wage as 100K they will still play the same game - may be with less profit. Look at their profit margin!! They almost make a 1 billion profit over 5 billion revenue (I saw it long back in forbe's list not sure now). So there is something terribly wrong or hidden somewhere. They are no way that special than say accenture and other peers. Someone has to hit them there and get back everything to normalization - otherwise many are suffering at different levels to make their profit.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:31 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to jake_leone

"When Jay realized that, he had no choice but to report it to Federal authorities, or risk being an accompliss to Federal crimes of Tax evasion, visa Fraud, and perjury."

Did you ever seen any employee of those organization got prosecuted ???

At the worst you get is rejection of B1 or L1 or H1 application...nothing beyond. Just add the criteria (if at all it was not there) of criminal prosecution right after rejection on the grounds of false application and follow it religiously..you will never ever receive any fraud application from those big companies.

Something (self-esteem or courage...) make Palmer to react rather accept it...

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:34 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to R. Lawson

I agree with that $2000 fee + pay them US salary when they are here on US and tax that salary, also make sure they get their Indian salary too. If it is so important to be here for few weeks or months then they deserve to be paid double than single small Indian salary.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:37 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

"Blackwater now known as Xe is also facing the fallout of a whistleblower's efforts to reveal their wrong doings. "

So all it takes is change the company name and continue your business as usual and let the old company(which by then has no money to pay any penalty) get whatever punishment...

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 9:56 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to Jake_Leone

- Cannot even make a clear statement on the numbers of Visa (H-1b, B-1, or L-1) issued

     It does have count of visa applications received but it never can give count on how many will be approved because it has to wait for the person to show-up for interview and if any administrative process involved they never know when it will get over. Every year it gives count of applications it has received all you need to do is look at their website.

- Workers not under the control of company that holds the visa, in fact several times the employee was on the other side of the country, working a completely different job.

     This was introduced or updated very recently and they are implementing very deligently on this. If you never went to single H1b interview you never get to know how it works. Just reading on different forum doesn't give you accurate pictures. I have seen personaly a visa officer was asking real technical question (What version of Oracle DB you where using in xxx project, how do you get historical data into your new database...it went on and on and finaly got rejected) and they have list (kind of black list) of companies both in India and US which will get any application rejected. And it gets updated every now and then, also they are doing onsite visit to check if the employee was really working there. They may not be doing it for every single application, but it always follows certain randomness to makesure not a single company escapes. Only bad part of their work is they don't reveal any of those information for public.

     

- Workers not being paid or being benched for several months, brought in under H-1b, and told to find a job in the United States .

     This has to be reported by the employee unless that company get audited on random case, and they make sure you provide updated information (tax statement,pay slip, etc...)

- Workers brought in as sex-workers, only found after local police discovered they were prostitutes.

     I really don't get this part...when they brought in as sex-workers and you expect police to find IT guru there ???? And under which visa was that ....are you not exagerating too much for anyone to consider you seriously....

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:15 AM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says: in response to who knows

"- Workers brought in as sex-workers, only found after local police discovered they were prostitutes."

That explains why the woman who propositioned me last week had an Infosys badge on.  LOL.  I kid.

I seriously doubt this is an "Infosys Issue" but there are certainly cases where criminal organizations are using the system for another type of "skilled" service provider and who knows what else. 

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:29 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says: in response to who knows

I kid you not.  There have been cases where people were brought in as sex workers under the H-1b.

www.zazona.com/shameh1b/Library/Archives/Lolitas.htm

We only know about the ones that get caught.

There you go.  I know, it seems so ridiculous as to not even be believable, but it is a fact.

H-1b is Slave-1b.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:32 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

On the Visa, no they actually have a very hard time even coming up with the number.

There have been years when, only after they audited their books, did they realize that they had let in tens of thousands of more H-1b visa'd workers than allowed under the law.

In recent years UCSIS and Dept. of Homeland Security have been asked for a number, but could not provide it to Congress.

I know, it seems ridiculous, but the truth is it is a ridiculous sloppy visa approval system. 

And gives new meaning to completely ineffective government.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:34 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

- Workers not being paid or being benched for several months, brought in under H-1b, and told to find a job in the United States .

This was part of the same Federal GAO report that found that more than 1-in-5 H-1b visas are fraudulent.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:38 AM VM VM  says: in response to SealTeam6

No one is worried here. Folks in this discussion need to stick to the issue. It is funny to see how you get on the defensive and push the other person when your argument does not stand! Now you are saying that USCIS does not verify any of the documentation. CIS indeed verifies documentations. Every year there are audits and actions are taken against organization such as IBM, CTS et al.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:40 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to Jake_Leone

It seems the level of uninformed rebuttal is a little higher today.  I wonder if this a PR thing going on, or maybe "Reputation-Defender" action.

I have been studying, watching, learning about the H-1b and other Visa programs for more than decade, actively commenting for about 8 years.

The reason I comment so vigorously and ascertively is because this program really stinks, and it stinks something aweful.

The 3 U.S. visa programs are the most hideously abused, economy destroying programs ever devised and abused in U.S. history.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:48 AM VM VM  says: in response to Don Tennant

Is that why you think that they are right? That you have taken sides and have started reporting for a person. It is now your opinion than a neutral reporting. It is emotion vs being rational....

If I were the attorney I would say go ahead and do it. We have what we believe is the evidence. now it is for the feds now to find out and prove us wrong and since we harp first and we get the benefit of mass sentiment.

Playing the devils advocate here - Agreed you have sworn confidentiality with Palmer and his lawyer but without bringing it in the open I would say it is still your opinion than facts!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:50 AM VM VM  says:

It will be interesting to see that too. But let's be practical. Thousands of such cases are settled using arbitration and law provisions for that. It is now in the hands of senators to sensationalize it in the minds of the people in wake of next years elections.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:53 AM VM VM  says: in response to Jake_Leone

Please read this again. Not many are aware of this provision

B-1 IN LIEU OF H-1B

Any person holding a B1 or B1/B2 visa may be eligible to perform H-1B work in the United States as long as they fulfill the following criteria:

Hold the equivalent of a U.S. bachelor's degree

Plan to perform H-1B-caliber work or training

Will be paid only by their foreign employer, except reimbursement of incidental travel costs such as housing and per diem. The employee must not receive any salary from a U.S. source.

The task can be accomplished in a short period of time.

These travelers would be admitted as B1 visitors, and may only stay in the U.S. for the time allotted by the Department of Homeland Security upon entry.

Also companies pay tax on income and when employer pays per diem and remuration in the foreign currency where is question of anyone paying taxes. Basic mis-understading of how taxation works.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:54 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says: in response to VM

Read Jay Palmers Testimony

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 10:56 AM Wakjob Wakjob  says:

"You can't read it without being blown away by the flagrancy and insidiousness of Infosys' alleged violations"

Don, I've got news for you. Most Indian companies and foreign Indian workers are like this. They are arrogant, pushy, rude, driven only by greed, and corruption is way of life. Why do hard and honest work when you can just deceive and steal instead? These Indian bodyshops are here plundering America and they are the most branzen criminals you have ever seen. It's not just Infy but the whole lot of them - over 10 million since 1998 we have brought in here.

You want to know why our economy is in trouble - this is why. We are being pludered.

What's worse, this has been going on for over 13 years and the gov't was totally blind to it until Palmer blew the whistle and went public. What does that say about our gov't?

India, Inc. cleaned out Silicon valley, then Detroit, then Wall St. now they are eyeing gov't contracts because that is the only place any $ is left. This is a complete and total cleanout of our economy.

This con has to stop and Americans musy be put back to work. If we aren't the USA will cease to exist. India's goal is to build its economy, and thus its military power and then attack us.

One Indian told me "it's payback time" (for the Brits' colonizing India 200 years ago). These people are here to rob us and that is all. It's ALL fraud.

And lest someone here say I am uneducated or don't have any credibility, I lived and worked in Silicon Valley for 16 years and wrote 18 commercial software products - I saw it happen firsthand.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:02 AM VM VM  says:

Trying to educate people and making them see a clear picture earns me a job at Infosys! That is a good way to get employed right?

Every coin has two sides and not always is one's opinion right over the other. If you can understand the intent then I succeed. If not I am preaching to the walls

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:05 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to VM

Heh.. I was just curious about how many Infosys employees are postimg here. It was a joke... I never expected an honest answer anyway...

At the end of the day, the visa for a foreign worker is a privilege, not a right. Make no mistake about that. The rules can be redrawn and changed at any time. From what I am told, foreigners in India have to register at the closest police station. We have no such requirement here. So please don't lecture us about our "unfair" rules.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:08 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to jake_leone

I really don't understand the need for anyone to bring those kind of isolated case in discussion of Infosys related issue and paint a picture that h1b's are bad...

Do you really want to use one such case to paint H1b is Slaves????

Do you think every single US citizen is not involved in any such cases ???

Just because one such idiot used H1 to bring a person and that person bring girls as his daughter is a case of H1B ?

And do you agree there could be cases like visitor visa got used to bring in people to do such dirty jobs ? So you want to paint all person on Visitor visa are here on dirty jobs.

Please refrain from such claims it does no good for anyone other than happiness to you by insulting people which is insane.

No matter how smart a organization/law/country there is always ways people will be there to break it...if not there is no need of any law enforcement officers in US and there won't be 2million people in US prison and US won't be the number one in number of prison (or in any country for that matter).

Casey Anthony is not a sample for all single mothers in US

President Clinton is not a sample for all married person in US

Michael P Fay is not a sample for all kids in US

Bernard Madoff is not a sample for all business person in US

Warren Jeffs is not a sample for all Church in US and his followers are not a sample for all people going to church.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:10 AM VM VM  says: in response to SealTeam6

Ok, then what is AR-11 for?

Of course rules can be redrawn and that is precisely my point. Stay on course with the issue!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:19 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to R. Lawson

"I seriously doubt this is an "Infosys Issue" but there are certainly cases where criminal organizations are using the system for another type of "skilled" service provider and who knows what else. "

  Roy, are you trying to suggest something here !!!!

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:28 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to VM

AR11 is a change of address with the USCIS so you can be contacted if you are staying somewhere other than the address listed on your initial application. You just mail in a form. It has  nothing to do with your local police as it does in India.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:37 AM VM VM  says: in response to SealTeam6

Police station is the policy there for a similar purpose. I don't see that gas any bearing whatsoever.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:46 AM BT1024 BT1024  says: in response to VM

Ron Hira's testimony for the July 26th hearing, was primarily about H-1B and L1 visas - he did make mention of the B-1 (and B-2) visa on pages 2, 10, and 11. He did not provide usage numbers for the B-1 visa (he only provided usage numbers for the H-1B and L1 visas).

Ron Hira's testimony - http://judiciary.senate.gov/pdf/11-7-26%20Hira%20Testimony.pdf

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:57 AM ctrl alt del ctrl alt del  says:

Sorry, but I just have to laugh at NRIs lecturing us on how our legal system will resolve this.

Infoscam is guilty, undeniably. Their actions are only illuminating it and digging them further into a hole.

After today's 'press release', I have to wonder if they consulted with the legal team. If I was the corporate attorney, I'd be sticking pencils in my eyes. They've set themselves back by trying to deny the allegations.

Reply
Jul 27, 2011 11:58 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

Hope you know as per USCIS "Failure to report change of Address is punishable by fine imprisonment and/or removal"

It is just difference in level of implementation nothing else, don't pick those silly things to define a country and claim your country has nothing like that.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 1:03 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

"It shows that every person picking those isolated case to spread nothing but hate."

Listen, I care about people and I don't forget about the massive abuse that has gone on under the H-1b system.

And I will keep discussing it and bringing it up. 

I am not spreading hate by bringing up the truth.  You are spreading hate by equating truth with hate.

You are obviously a pro-Replace-Every-U.S.-Citizen troll. 

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 1:19 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says:

Infosys is acting like some a company that has a lot to hide.

This massive character assassination campaign that is going on against Jay Palmer is a classic example of Public Relations and Lawyers trying to change the subject.

Jay's testimony is quite damning and I look forward to the evidence, subpoenas and testimony.

It must be that InfoSys realizes that there is no other way to fight this except to attempt to destroy someone's reputation.  They must be in a state of fear at InfoSys over this issue.

I remember when Monica Lewinsky first broke the news about the affair with the (Clinton) President, the President's legal team threatened Monica with a massive libel suit.   When the stain evidence was released, and that there could be a DNA test performed, Clinton came on T.V., admitted what had occurred, and attempted redefine what "is" means.

I care about people here on H-1b;

- I want the H-1bers to own their own Green Card process, and I want only people who are seriously trying to become U.S. citizens to use the H-1b program.

InfoSys and the other outsourcing companies, and those who rely on them, don't want that.

- I don't want companies such as InfoSys, which don't even try to hire U.S. Citizens (and actively remove whole departments to offshore sites), to be even allowed to use any of the Visa programs without significant U.S. worker protection.

It is quite clear from Jay's testimony that InfoSys is heavily abusing the U.S. visa system, and that fraud, criminal activity, and abuse should all be brought to light in a Court-Of-Law.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 1:39 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says: in response to who knows

Look, this discussion is about abuse of H-1b by companies, centered on InfoSys.  If you can't handle the truth, that's your problem.

Frankly, SaraR, we only see the tip of the ice-berg of the abuse that goes on of America's Visa programs.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 2:02 AM Jobs4us Jobs4us  says: in response to SealTeam6

Bravo! Well said.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 2:28 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to Jake_Leone

What makes you to think those poor girls are here as sex-workers when they are kept in hostage and got raped and killed.Because they won't hunt you down for misrepresentation you decided to pick them ?

And you claim it is has nothing to do with spreading hate....nice try though.

For sure you owe an apology to those two poor souls.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 2:34 AM iPhone_rocks iPhone_rocks  says: in response to Jake_Leone

Jake, I am glad to know you are not completely against Indians, and please stay on the core issue here, which is the services companies like InfoSys, TCS, Cognizant. I am not a big fan of Indian consulting companies, which has nothing to offer but bodies. There are lot of better, smarter and innovative companies in India. Unfortunately, due to these massive man power companies, the smaller startups are not in the lime light. These consulting companies are no good for any innovations and they have not done anything meaningful in last 25 years with their growth and profit. I agree these companies know all the crooked ways to pull a dime.

However, legal immigration is not fruitful either. I came to work for a small startup in 2000 and am still waiting in the line to get my green card. I feel US is my home, raising a family and try to be a good citizen. This long wait is painful, because my GC process is tied to my employer. I wanted to invest and start a company with a friend of mine here, but my current resident status does not allow that. The immigration senate hearing was about the legal immigration. I hope you support that.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 2:35 AM Employers displace US citizens for these jobs... Employers displace US citizens for these jobs...  says: in response to R. Lawson

Hiding in broad daylight - REAL fraud straight from the USDOL FLC 2009 reports.

Congress WHY can't employers find qualified Americans to fill these jobs? Come on, English teachers in Texas, Urban Transportation planners in Phoenix, Killer Whale Researchers in WA,  Kindergarten Teachers, Montessori Teachers, and Pharmacists everywhere????

WAKE UP Congress and  DO YOUR job.  Voting to support more fraud like this is TREASON.    This is PURE  Baloney

Animators

Athletic Trainers

Calligraphers

CEO

Concept Artists

Concept artists  WA

English Teachers in Texas

Ensemble managers

Graphic Artists

Groundfish observers  WA

High fashion models  

Infant Mental Health

Killer Whale Research Coordinators  WA

Lacrosse Team Sales Manager

Live Performance Calligraphers

Marriage Counselors 

Mental health counselors 

Mountain guides

Phys Ed Teachers

Singers

Space administrators Western Washington

Wartime Education PR Managers

Washington State Employment Security IT specialist

Washington State Investment Board senior investment office 

Youth Lacrosse Program Director

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 2:44 AM Guest Worker Hall of Shame Guest Worker Hall of Shame  says:

Guest worker Hall of Shame - Source USDOL FLC 2009

Tech Revo        Do you REALLY need to hire H-1B only Autoworkers from India for Ohio jobs?

Opus 119         Do you REALLY need to hire H-1B only Flute Teachers for your Irvine, CA School?

Hyatt               Do you REALLY need to hire H-1B only Bartenders for your east coast hotels?

Arizona            Do you REALLY need to hire H-1B only Transit Planners from India for Phoenix?

CVS                  Do you REALLY need to hire 400 H-1B pharmacists from India for Rhode Island?

Texas             Do you REALLY need to hire American History teachers from India for public schools?

California        Do you REALLY need to hire H-1B Kindergarten teachers and spend $966 Million 2008 salaries? 

California            Do you REALLY need to hire H-1B Montessori teachers and spend, $1.5 million Montessori salaries?

WA State         Do you REALLY cut basic medical care for 100,000 citizens on public assistance to subsidize college tuition for Microsoft H-1Bs who already receive MS tuition reimbursement and earn  $92k, 2x the state's avg income?

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 2:59 AM FUD Features FUD Features  says: in response to who knows

Infosys Amateur Hour - Today's FUD (fear, uncertainty, and doubt) features

Buzzword Bingo -- Protectionist, harassment

Here comes the Judge - Invent your own US laws

Runway Models expose this season's invisible clothing line for the emperor

FUD dud - "taking one harassment case and painting the whole company is a bad idea" 

Brought to you by American Tech Workers - We're Smarter than you think we are

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 3:04 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

These girls were victims.  And I will never forget them. 

The case clearly shows that H-1b is used by human traffickers.

But as I say this is just the tip of iceberg and we only see the worst cases.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 3:07 AM hireamerica hireamerica  says: in response to Guest Worker Hall of Shame

Dr.William L. Carlson, Administrator - Foreign Labor Certification , seems to be doing a bang up job :P

Wonder how much he gets paid :P

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 3:10 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says:

The Slave-1b system is a favorite of the human traffickers because the company owns the Green Card process, and if the Company decides to terminate the employment then they worker must leave.

This forces the worker to keep their mouth shut and allows the company to have an indentured workforce.  It allows people to be bought an sold, like these 2 girls were.

Frankly, if a person really wants to be a U.S. citizen, abide by our laws, I am all for that.  And I proudly say it.

Of course we cannot have unlimited immigration into the United States, it must be strictly limited.  Right now have too many H-1b visa available and they are going to companies that in the business of removing jobs from U.S. economy.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 4:04 AM sam sam  says:

Kudos to Jack Palmer..I am a us citizen of Indian orgin..when i was working for chrysller, syntel was one of the sub contractors for the project and i was an employee of syntel. They brought a girl from india on B1 visa and worked along side myself in doing coding and business support..and she is paid indian salary with an allowance of $30/day..so i end up droping her after the work as she don't have money to hire a cap...It is time we send back and cancel all the H1/L1/B1 visa and send all these cheap folks home. CUDOS to Jack Palmer , i will send  more details about my expereince to your atorney.. let us stop this crap of visa holders..Let us throw them back.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 4:19 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to iPhone_rocks

Definitely support legal immigration, and I wish you the best.

I might sound like traitor when I say this, but I don't believe in disenfranchising illegal immigrants.  I think we should provide elementary/high school education.  A friend of mine pointed out, if the kids are not in school, then what will they be doing? (Crime, drugs, getting depressed), we gotta use humanity (there is no such thing as World Citizenship) to guide us on this.

As for College, no, because the person is old enough to travel back to their home country for education.  But in good times (which we are not in right now), we can bend a little even on the College side, and be good, charitable people.

I have been fortunate to see several of my colleagues become U.S. citizens.

And I have seen the anguish of co-workers who are waiting for their Green Card.  And I wish/want the very best for them.  Some of them own homes, and I want them to stay in order to become citizens.

You got to be human about this issue and I am against any form of disenfranchisement (as much as I am against discrimination). 

And Refugees, definitely we need to help.  We could have saved millions of people just prior to WWII, and they would have come at a good time.

But I also believe in citizenship, and that it should be the goal visa and Green Card program to shepherd people towards citizenship.

Companies like InfoSys are an anathema to the Citizenship process.  Very few (~1%) of InfoSys H-1b visa's workers wind up becoming citizens.  A microscopic number, compared to H-1b workers in domestic and non-outsourcing companies. 

Work Visas given to outsourcing companies are pure economic and social poison.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 6:47 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to iPhone_rocks

I love India, but I love the United States more.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 9:09 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to jake_leone

It is not about handling truth my friend. It is so bad that every isolated case is used to paint bad picture on H1bs. It shows that every person picking those isolated case to spread nothing but hate.

And by the way bringing one case from 1999 (you have nothing in recent past to bring it on!!!!) and trying say it is somehow linked to Infosys or to every h1b is nothing but spreading hate.

And what kind of link you have put in place...seriously you have no other credible and decent looking news site (seriously you can't get one decent news site to cover this news!!!!) to share with us. Your link is pure graphic with nude photo of a girl (nude photo of girl!!!!) and that is called as porn website. There is no need of sharing such a porn site in Don't blog.

You did not stopped there...if at that news is having some truth...those girls where brought here and got abused and raped(both are minors!!!!)..nothing to do with prostitution...and you decided to paint those poor girls who got abused as prostitutes...

All you did here was  simple character assassination of innocent kids!!! and one kid was dead and you painted her as prostitute!!!  you are real sick person has nothing to do with bringing truth but fully involved in misleading and spreading hate on every h1bs possible.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 9:44 AM New2AllThis New2AllThis  says: in response to Jake_Leone

Knowing how Infosys works, they have got assurances from their legal team that this can be dismissed. Else, they would have settled this out of court already.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 9:59 AM Uday Uday  says: in response to who knows

I think the solution to some of the visa issues is very simple. For b1 just make 4 weeks as the days of stay. If you need more than four weeks, you have to go online and ask for it which can be base on either scrutiny or fees. The problem will be gone in days.

To provide companies short term work visa, have a fees like 2000 usd per month upto 3 months. For longer have a fees of 3000 usd per mont unto 9 months. For anything longer ask people to apply long term work visa. Restrict multiple entries for the person availing such visa.

Use this money to train US workers.  There can be variations of this solutions which should end the Economic incentives of not hiring in US.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 10:04 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to who knows

"Again taking one harassment case and painting the the whole company is bad idea."

Just one ? Are you sure about that ? I think that's news to Jennifer Griffith

Infosys settle sexual harassment case
Former Infosys director Phaneesh Murthy has reached a $800,000 settlement with ex-Infosys employee - American Jennifer Griffith - in the sexual harassment lawsuit she filed against him and Infosys in 2003

http://www.expressindia.com/news/fullstory.php?newsid=38837

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 10:15 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

So, what you are trying to say here....when there is 100k+ employees you expect every one is sane person like you !!!!

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 10:51 AM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to who knows

So are you saying that there are insane people at the highest levels of management at Infosys ? That sounds like it... $3.8 million between those cases. Sure was some expensive sex...

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 11:39 AM Contact these Infosys US clients Contact these Infosys US clients  says: in response to Uday

Please send the CEOs and Media Relations contacts at these USA Infosys clients a link to Don's article about the Senate Testimony

http://www.itbusinessedge.com/cm/blogs/tennant/infosys-whistleblower-provides-hard-hitting-testimony-to-senate-hearing/?cs=47997

Ask these employers what are they doing about their role in this visa fraud on their company premises and why they are illegally hiring Infosys B1 visa workers instead of qualified Americans?   

Please spread the word.   Thank you

Blockbuster  Dallas TX 

Blockbuster knocked out of business with Infosys

http://tinyurl.com/infosysblockbuster

Blue Cross & Blue Shield Association Chicago, DC and 39 Blues across USA

America's got the Blues for Outsourced Blue Cross US Jobs to Infosys

http://tinyurl.com/infosysblues

Boeing-Chicago, Seattle

Crashing and burning American Careers while 787 flying high with Infosys

http://tinyurl.com/infosysboeing

Cummins Inc.Columbus IN

Disconnects US citizens from jobs and deprives Indiana voters USA jobs

http://tinyurl.com/infosyscummins

Hallmark Kansas City, MO

When you care enough to layoff Americans and outsource their jobs to Infosys. Who needs birthday cards when you can't afford to eat?  http://tinyurl.com/infosyshallmark

Infosys Health Benefit Exchange  (DC, 50 states)

Obama Cares About Jobs for Infosys not Americans

Infosys state insurance exchanges to serve 30 million US citizens under Affordable Care Act

http://tinyurl.com/infosysobamacare

Microsoft, Redmond, WA

Infosys $100 million deal to outsource more Microsoft USA jobs to Infosys

Many articles (recent samples)

http://tinyurl.com/infosysMicrosoft1 

http://tinyurl.com/infosysMicrosoft2 

http://tinyurl.com/infosysMicrosoft3

Moneygram, Minneapolis MN

Sends money to Infosys outsourcer anywhere in the world, but no payday loans to its laid off American workforce

http://preview.tinyurl.com/infosysmoneygram

Northwestern Mutual Milwaukee WI,

Secure YOUR Financial Future, only if you illegally work for Infosys in the USA on a B-1 visa

http://tinyurl.com/infosysnwmutual

Seattle City Light (Seattle, WA) 

Turns off lights for USA citizens by outsourcing USA jobs to Infosys

http://tinyurl.com/infosysSeattleCityLight

Aetna Hartford CT, Blue Bell PA

Aetna Healthcare offshores Information Technology to Infosys, India for 10 years   

http://tinyurl.com/infosysaetnahc

Horizon Blue Cross Newark NJ

NJ provider of State and Federal government employees medical insurance offshores information technology to Infosys  

http://tinyurl.com/infosyshorizonblue

Mercy Health Plans  (St Louis MO, Springfield MO, Laredo TX, Oklahoma, Kansas, Arkansas) 

Mercy offshores information technology to Infosys India  

http://tinyurl.com/infosysmercyhealth      

California Medical Plan

Health plan provider offshores USA Medicare Medicaid projects to

http://tinyurl.com/infosysCAmedicare

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:02 PM hireamerican hireamerican  says: in response to VM

As with anything, the devil is in the details.

"Plan to perform H-1B-caliber work or training"

I have seen B1 and H1b employees do things like timesheets,billing invoices and general admin tasks.

Big whooop there :P

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:05 PM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to who knows

The point is in the US there is just one level of check for entry: the USCIS. Once you are in the country you are minimally monitored. The local police dont hassle you (and considering the level of corruption in the Indian police force, I can imagine interacting with them is not easy). Unlike India where foreigners are closely monitored. And yes, you break the law, you pay the price here. I think that's the whole point of this thread isn't it ?

Oh and this apparently isn't Infosys first run-in with an unhappy employee who filed a case against them. The Reka Maximovitch sexual harassment case should have taught them something. Guess not.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:09 PM iPhone_rocks iPhone_rocks  says: in response to Wakjob

Please stay on the topic and don't blindly bash all Indians for the wrong doings of Indian consulting companies. How can you blame an entire race based on one a$$hole you met?

Since you worked on Silicon valley, I am sure Chinese outnumber Indians pretty easily in Tech companies and the population over there. I don't see any bashing towards them. Does this have anything to do with the color of the skin?

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:10 PM ctrl alt del ctrl alt del  says: in response to SealTeam6

'At the end of the day, the visa for a foreign worker is a privilege, not a right.'

Couldn't have said it better myself. The majority of the dreamers and manipulators over on IV need to write this over and over on the chalkboard so they might understand it.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:20 PM ctrl alt del ctrl alt del  says: in response to iPhone_rocks

Public opinion is at the fore. Don't deny that the Indian temp worker image now needs some damage control rescue. There is a long uphill slog to fix the public perception. This particular blog isn't the yardstick... any editorial covering H1B or outsourcing generates similar dissent. There is work to be done you want it fixed.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:25 PM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

And is it the only company have insane people at the highest levels of management ???

No company can validate how insane a person until they show their insane character some or the other way. And your company and family doesn't know how sane your  are (with immigrants) until they read all your comments here .

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:26 PM who knows who knows  says: in response to SealTeam6

Just US doing in one place with one agency doesn't make it any different than in India. Did you every worked with USCIS and how did you concluded it is doing minimal monitoring. They will send snail mail to you if you forget to update them about your change of address, how they come to know is their own little secret.

After 9/11 US has spending so much money and time in monitoring foreigners just you don't happen to know about it. Still I don't argue it was wrong...instead I say it is good and have to increase monitoring as much as possible because I don't harm anyone it doesn't mean no one else. So it is better be safe than sorry, and monitoring is not such a bad thing to do.

And if you ever boarded any flight after 9/11 you will know how much US does to make sure people are safe, it does hurts peoples feeling (when a 6yr old girl got full patted down by TSA) but still when it is done in the name of safety everyone has to go with it.

Again taking one harassment case and painting the the whole company is bad idea.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:40 PM who knows who knows  says: in response to Uday

Uday...I agree and accept that would be right path for best solution.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:47 PM R. Lawson R. Lawson  says: in response to who knows

" Roy, are you trying to suggest something here !!!!"

Yes, the H-1b isn't just for doctors, scientists, and junior level Java developers. 

The "main" thing wrong with the program is that it enables offshoring and drives down wages.  There are some cases of it being used for criminal activity, but my guess is that the offshoring firms snatch up all the visas before the pimps can.  They have better lawyers.

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:53 PM Infosys USA Customers - Hall of Shame Infosys USA Customers - Hall of Shame  says:

Please send the CEO, PR/Media leads of these US Infosys customers a link to Don's coverage of the US Senate Testimony about Infosys

www.itbusinessedge.com/cm/blogs/tennant/infosys-whistleblower-provides-hard-hitting-testimony-to-senate-hearing/?cs=47997

Ask them why they illegally hire Infosys B-1 visa workers to work on their company sites instead of qualified, high skill American citizens and GC staff.

Please spread the word.   Thank you

INFOSYS USA Clients  - Hall of Shame

Aetna Hartford CT, Blue Bell PA

Aetna Healthcare offshores Information Technology to Infosys, India for 10 years   

tinyurl.com/infosysaetnahc ;

Blockbuster  Dallas TX 

Blockbuster knocked out of business with Infosys

tinyurl.com/infosysblockbuster

Blue Cross & Blue Shield Association Chicago, DC and 39 Blues across USA

America's got the Blues for Outsourced Blue Cross US Jobs to Infosys

tinyurl.com/infosysblues

Boeing-Chicago, Seattle

Crashing and burning American Careers while 787 flying high with Infosys

tinyurl.com/infosysboeing

Cummins Inc.Columbus IN

Disconnects US citizens from jobs and deprives Indiana voters USA jobs

tinyurl.com/infosyscummins

Hallmark Kansas City, MO

When you care enough to layoff Americans and outsource their jobs to Infosys. Who needs birthday cards when you can't afford to eat?  tinyurl.com/infosyshallmark

Horizon Blue Cross Newark NJ

NJ provider of State and Federal government employees medical insurance offshores information technology to Infosys  

tinyurl.com/infosyshorizonblue

Mercy Health Plans  (St Louis MO, Springfield MO, Laredo TX, Oklahoma, Kansas, Arkansas) 

Mercy offshores its USA information technology to Infosys India  

tinyurl.com/infosysmercyhealth      

Microsoft, Redmond, WA

Infosys $100 million deal to outsource more Microsoft USA jobs to Infosys

Many articles (recent samples)

tinyurl.com/infosysMicrosoft1 ;

tinyurl.com/infosysMicrosoft2 ;

tinyurl.com/infosysMicrosoft3

Moneygram, Minneapolis MN

Sends money to Infosys outsourcer anywhere in the world, but no payday loans to its laid off American workforce

preview.tinyurl.com/infosysmoneygram

Northwestern Mutual Milwaukee WI

Secure YOUR Financial Future, only if you illegally work for Infosys in the USA on a B-1 visa

tinyurl.com/infosysnwmutual

Seattle City Light (Seattle, WA) 

Turns off lights for USA citizens by outsourcing USA jobs to Infosys

tinyurl.com/infosysSeattleCityLight

Reply
Jul 28, 2011 12:56 PM SealTeam6 SealTeam6  says: in response to who knows

The fact is Infosys has a less than stellar record with its handling of this and past incidents. They are not going to garner a lot of sympathy.

Right, cause you know.  the "immigrants" posting here are such poor souls who such are truthful, sane and trustworthy. If you feel so badly about these posts you are welcome to leave the board. You do have that option you know, just as you also have the option to leave the country if you feel unfairly treated here. Remember, your being here is a privilege, not a right. I think that detail somehow escapes a lot of the "immigrant" posters here.

Reply
Jul 29, 2011 1:52 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to Su

I think love is the actual motivator for the posting (for/against) InfoSys and Visa reform.

I think that a big part of what is perceived/painted as "hate" is actually just hysteria-bating and people catering to hysteria.  It's easy to label anyone, who is for immigration enforcement as a "Zenophobic-hate-monger".  Again it's just catering hysteria, the U.S. needs real solutions that work for the economy, not the polarizing speech of people with a different economic agenda.

Hey, I can understand that people from other countries want to help their fellow country-people get a better standard of living.  But the U.S. is on the verge of default and one of the biggest contributors to that default has been the high unemployment in the last 3.5 years.  Immigration and Visa policies have contributed to the unemployment by allowing outsourcing companies to use our Visa system in order to obtain virtually all of their man-power from back home overseas.  And, at the same time, these outsourcing companies are engaged in removing jobs from the United States.

Dumbest loophole, ever.

Whether you are Republican or Democrat, you love this country, and we have got to work together to get U.S. citizens off the unemployment line and into jobs, if we are going to really stop the budget deficits we have seen during this economic crisis.

Reply
Jul 29, 2011 2:01 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says: in response to New2AllThis

The character assassination that is going down in the Indian press is hardly the actions of a confident defense team.  I am sure that it would have been worth it to settle a long time ago, because Jay's salary is probably nothing compared to the cost of defending yourself against federal charges of Tax Evasion and Fraud.

Confident defense lawyers would always advice their clients to keep their mouth shut and wait for their day in court.  I think InfoSys knows they are playing for big dollars here, and is acting very desparate.

If you look at the case history, it really looks rather amateur.  Flooding consulate with applications, hoping some will get through.  Trying to interfere with federal evidence gathering by unsuccessfully demanding Jay's laptop.

Me thinks InfoSys doth protest too much.

Reply
Jul 29, 2011 5:07 AM hireamerica hireamerica  says: in response to Jake_Leone

It appears the mood on the hill IS turning sour to outsourcing

Reply
Jul 29, 2011 9:39 AM Su Su  says: in response to Jake_Leone

"I love India, but I love the United States more."~

Very positive response. Unfortunately the entire discussions here are not about 'love' - it is about who hates who.

Just read through all the comments in different topics.

Reply
Jul 29, 2011 9:48 AM ctrl alt del ctrl alt del  says: in response to New2AllThis

Riiiiight. You obviously know better than the rest of us.

Reply
Jul 30, 2011 4:51 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to jake_leone

What kind of fear you have...when I said those girls are not sex workers...and you clearly mentioned them as sex workers...this is what you had posted...

"I kid you not.  There have been cases where people were brought in as sex workers under the H-1b.

www.zazona.com/shameh1b/Library/Archives/Lolitas.htm

We only know about the ones that get caught."

Will you do the same if one of your family member or friend got in such a worst scenario....and call them "s** workers" because one criminal raped them...so as per your terms any kids who got raped are "s** workers" and you say you are neutral and not having any hate. Just because those kids are from India you decided to brand them as "S** worker" and you want us to believe you are not spreading hate. Now you turned your voice as saver of life!!!!

What kind of legitimate site will put a nude image (graphics) on their news ? Even if the news is about porn... legitimate site won't post nude images. The news is about abuse/rape of kids and that site used nude picture that shows what kind of site it is.

I am against painting bad image on people on work visa...nothing more. You have solution and fixing all issues in work visa I will welcome it...but won't go with cherry picking bad news about work visa and keep posting in forum which indirectly suggest they all fall under the same fraud.

You never get it...no matter how hard you enforce there are criminals who will keep trying to hack the system. If one criminal used a system doesn't mean every one using it is criminal. If few people get it in fraudulent way doesn't mean every one is fraud. All it is called stereotyping don't claim you are not trying stereotyping when you generalize every single immigrant on the ground of few criminals.

Now there is news about how school kids cheat (11th graders) with the help of their teachers (news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/widespread-teacher-sanctioned-cheating-20110308-102616-616.html) ...how do you expect STEM grads from these students and what kind of attitude they come with when they come to labor force. Now will you say all the students in US graduate by fraudulent manner? When 100s of thousand of student participate in this fraud how do you expect to have good labor force after 5yrs (by when they expected to join the labor force). Tomorrow my kids will go through same education system.....

"Similarly, the Times Square Bomber.  Similarly 911 (here on student visa) would have been prevented."

Again cherry picking criminals using the program should not be reason for labeling everyone (by bringing those news here you indirectly suggest that). If you do that you will end up creating multiple TSAs in USA. But despite of TSAs huge effort there was a underwear bomber....so now TSA is putting full body scanner. Will it stop the crime nope...simply criminals will outsource the job to Americans who wants to hurt America (there are some idiots in all countries).

You provided some facts but some are pure non-fact and trying to hide under few facts.

Reply
Jul 30, 2011 10:33 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to jake_leone

" Right now have too many H-1b visa available and they are going to companies that in the business of removing jobs from U.S. economy."

This statement fit to your own word "hysteria" of immigrants taking jobs from US. If H1b's are here and jobs are here...if you stop H1b for sure those jobs will go to India/China. If you think like business man you will know what they will do next to make their work done (at any cost...doesn't mean fraudulent act)

Do you have any fact to share with everyone to that shows H1b's are removing jobs from US economy ?

Here is my share of facts from credible source which have access to all available data (something not seen by any other sources).

According to recent GAO report (released on January 2011...nothing as latest as this one)  on H1b Visa program.

There are 247k h1bs (Initial and Extensions) currently (as of 2009) are in US...guess what as of 2001 there was 347k h1bs(initial and extensions ) in US. In a decade h1b count came down by 100k for various reasons.

Don't think those 100k got GC and eventually become citizens, if most of them are India (47%) and China(8.9%) it will take a decade to get GC. And as per the report only 18% of total h1b filed for GC.

Another surprise from the report...as most claim H1b are cheap...but report shows there are more cases h1b paid equal or higher than US citizens.

In IT field (which has lion share),

Age group 20 - 29 h1b gets paid $60k(median salary) where as citizens gets paid $58k. And this is excluding expenses associated with getting visa which averages at $4k.

Age group 30 - 39 h1b and US citizens gets paid $70k median salary. Again this is excluding expenses associated with getting visa which averages at $4k.

Age group 40 - 50 h1b gets paid $77k where as US citizens gets paid $84k.Again this is excluding expenses associated with getting visa which averages at $4k. Also h1b's in age group 40-50 contributes only 3% of total count.

I was not getting any credible data on unemployment related to most h1b's work area, but this GAO report even provides credible information on that too.

Unemployment rate on year 2000 was @2% and went up to 3% on 2003 then came down to 2% by 2007 and by 2008 it was around 3% and finally it reach 4.4% by 2009. So if unemployment was not created by h1bs from 2000 - 2008  it couldn't have created unemployment from 2008 - 2011.

Reply
Jul 30, 2011 11:09 AM hireamerica hireamerica  says: in response to who knows

And we will either boycott said company products, or make our lawmakers pass laws to increase their taxes. We have finally woken up and have the power!!!

Reply
Jul 30, 2011 11:43 AM jake_leone jake_leone  says: in response to who knows

"and that is called as porn website."

ZAZONA is not a porn website.  Pure Hysteria bating on your.

In fact all you rebuttals have been pure hysteria.

www.zazona.com/shameh1b/Library/Archives/Lolitas.htm

Hey, its the truth about how this program has been abused.

We need to increase the fees and increase the enforcement.  If we had had strict audit, enforcement, and fees to pay for this these things, these 2 girls might still be with us and safe from harm.

Similarly, the Times Square Bomber.  Similarly 911 (here on student visa) would have been prevented.

These cases illustrate what happens when you have lax enforcement of our Visa laws.  And as result more than 1-in-5 H-1b visas were found to be fraudulent. 

And with Jay's testimony, we are seeing that the B-1 and L-1 are similarly rife with fraud.

Indeed we need to, at least, enforce our laws, and that costs money we don't have, therefore we must increase the fees.  And the fees should be born by those who use the visa system and do not even attempt to read the resumes of honest U.S. citizens who are willing to compete for work on U.S. soil.

All the hysteria bate you can muster won't change the facts SaraR.

Reply
Jul 31, 2011 9:13 AM who knows who knows  says: in response to Jake_Leone

It seems you decided to skip answering my real question of why would you call those innocent kids "s** workers". And no news site need nudity to promote their news...you call it the you want but there is standard for all news sites and when your reference deviate from it...it will fall under porn site. You disagree and enjoy the site fine...no one can stop you.

And for your wake up call...they don't have to send any engineers to learn anything here...if you stop visas they have something called "Network" with which you can virtually learn every single things possibly learn in-person. In-person learning my be better but that is not the only way you can transfer jobs to offshore. By saying we will stop visa to offshore company then job offshore will stop is illusion...if you close your eyes world won't go dark. All these could have done some protection if it all it was tried 2 decades ago ...now with super fast networks you have no chance to block off shoring.

Nope US did not defend when 9/11 was happened, it was just victim and it took a decade to capture the terrorist(leader). And for what reason (fake reason) US went to hunt Iraq instead of hunting that stupid terrorist.  US spend all money on wars that is the main reason it is suffering now nothing else. At least India never go to war so that don't have to spend on something you can't win but we keep trying with peace talk with idiots.

Charge them the true cost (already over charging...border protection fee of $2000 per visa)...but don't claim it will stop off-shoring.

Reply
Jul 31, 2011 9:59 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

Thanks for GEO location information Sara.

Good luck with that pacifist stance to terrorism.

Too bad Freedom is not Free.

Reply
Jul 31, 2011 11:16 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

"you call it the you want but there is standard for all news sites and when your reference deviate from it..."

Well "your" standard would make all Renaissance art galleries, porn galleries.

So I hope you can catch up with last 6 centuries.

Reply
Jul 31, 2011 11:58 AM Ram Ram  says: in response to Jake_Leone

As an Indian, here is what I would say to Mr. Palmer

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win! - M.K. Gandhi

Infy is currently fighting it out . Visa abuse an open secret, I hope many more abusers are brought to justice, by justice I mean real justice not just a pay out.

Reply
Jul 31, 2011 12:01 PM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

Sara, Nudity is not pornography. 

If it is then you are calling art since the Renaissance pornography.  Of course that fits this mind-set a person who caters to hysteria.

The U.S. decides who gets the visa.

InfoSys, Tata, HCL are offshore outsourcing companies.  Their typical operation is to send a few engineers over to learn all occupations in a department (of possibly hundred to thousands of people per contract) and then remove those jobs offshore.

Giving Visa to these companies, who hire virtually no U.S. citizens engineers, who never even consider hiring U.S. citizen, who use the money to propagandize against U.S. workers (much as you do SaraR) is always going to be the wrong thing to do.

And we have the right to point out the utter weakness of our immigration system.  In that they have allowed several tragedies to occur because they (our immigration service and FBI) didn't have enough resources to monitor and track people.

You know the U.S. can't operate like India, where bombing and massacre are left uncountered.  We don't lie down when people attack us, we sacrifice and we defend.

The cost to apprehend and capture the 911 terrorist (with a more affective administration) would have been just few billion more dollars.  And hundreds of thousand, if not millions, of people would still be alive.

Instead hundreds of thousands have died and Trillions were spent to remedy an aweful situation. 

And that will play out again and again, unless we charge companies the true cost to defend our borders.

Reply
Jul 31, 2011 12:39 PM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

I look for cause and affect. 

They way you are quoting stats reminds me of the way sport castors will quote how many times one unrelated thing happens because of another unrelated thing.

H-1b workers routinely make 15-25% less than there U.S. citizen counterparts.  Would that mean I would say they are not as valuable, no.

A more reasonable cause and affect would, many H-1b workers come in, as "Freshers" straight out-of-college, and the more experienced worker trains them.  Then the more experienced work, usually a U.S. citizen, is terminated.

Cause-and-effect.

Similary, in the cases that I meantion, I never write that this is the fault or because of the H-1b worker.  Workers are not to blame for this.  There is however a cost associated with our Visa programs.

With proper reform H-1b can be a good program again.  A good program in this case, must be 100%, we need every job we can muster.  Right now, in way too many cases, H-1b, B-1, and L-1 are destroying U.S. jobs.  90% is not acceptable, beause that 10% would be used to facilitate the offshoring of U.S. jobs, in a far greater quantity than any provided by the other 90%.

Offshoring companies should have no access to B-1, L-1, or H-1b visa, without severe restriction period.

A cost that United States cannot afford to bear from general revenue.  In the case of the 911 terrorists, if they had more agents reviewing the reports, more check/recheck they could have caught these guys, and save millions of lives. 

Odd that at the time, our H-1b visa system was peaking usage, just that, just odd.   But if we had been charging more for those Visas and puttting money back in to our immigration-related law enforcement, we could have prevented 911.

It's a fair deal, a good one, that protects the innocent.

I know that Industry works this way.  The CEO gets it started, maybe just profitable.  If that CEO can't increase the profits through sales, they look for other ways to increase profits.  Maybe add Lead to the gasoline, maybe cut-back on the oil-platform safety requirements, maybe find an additive that allows them to make kool-aid at .001 cents per package, and the sell the Kool-aid for a buck.  Maybe cut wages, look for cheaper workers, and bring them in, under B-1 (hot H-1b) or L-1, this increase profits. 

But it does so at the expense of the U.S. public.

- Unsafe oil platforms blow up

- Certain additives to beverage mixes cause cancer

- Workers under B-1 don't pay U.S. taxes, yet are afforded access to all our infrastructure and defenses.  And the U.S. is probably defaulting this week.

Cause-and-affect.

    Cause, And, Effect.

End-of-Lesson

Reply
Aug 1, 2011 12:43 PM who knows who knows  says: in response to Jake_Leone

So again you decided to skip to answer my question "why you called those innocent kids 's** workers' and paint it as if h1b got used to get 's** workers' ".

Reply
Aug 6, 2011 10:31 AM Jake_Leone Jake_Leone  says: in response to who knows

I did answer it, just go back and re-read my posts.

Reply
Dec 14, 2011 6:38 AM Shri Shri  says: in response to sam

What a pathetically written post by someone who claims to be a person of Indian origin. CLearly, it is a travesty for the school where he learnt and dropped out of - come out of shadows Johny boy - and accept you are not a person of Indian origin...

Reply
Dec 14, 2011 6:41 AM Shri Shri  says: in response to Shri

JAke- most of your posts are trolling . While I agree with some of your statements, as SaraR mentioned, you can not generalize a specific case. Clearly, you need to cite your references as well.. Anyways, needless to say I agree with SaraR - when there are 14 million illegal immigrants, why the ire on law abiding, tax paying 1 million Legal immigrants?

Reply

Post a comment

 

 

 

 


(Maximum characters: 1200). You have 1200 characters left.

 

null
null

 

Subscribe to our Newsletters

Sign up now and get the best business technology insights direct to your inbox.