H-1Bs Are Not Necessarily the Answer

Ralph DeFrangesco
For my final vacation post, I have to turn to my friend again for inspiration. We were out to lunch and he noticed that I appeared to be gazing, which I tend to do when I am thinking. "OK, what's on your mind", he asked?I remembered that he said he had a junior administrator backing him up while he was away on vacation. I asked whether he was concerned that he had someone with so little experience backing him up. He immediately saw where I was going with my question. He knows me all too well, and admitted that it was a less-than-ideal situation. Although he supports a small organization -- less than 100 users -- what they do is fairly critical and has to be kept up and running.He noted that he was only about an hour and a half from work and if worse came to worse, he could drive back. In addition, he had Internet access. I told him that was no way to work.He said that they were having a hard time finding qualified people, so the company decided to bring on a person with some practical experience and then train him. When searching for administrators, the company tended to get a lot of "paper-certified" candidates, meaning they had passed certification tests but had little practical experience. The company did consider looking at an H-1B option, but decided that training its own administrators internally made more sense. He also pointed out that you can't really check the credentials and work experience of most H-1B workers, and that was a big concern. Also, there is a lot of paper work his company didn't want to get involved in and, of course, there are the lawyers to deal with. I did point out asIT BusinessEdge blogger Ann Alldid that there arethat they should look into.We discussed other strategies such as outsourcing,and a managed service provider, but still came back to the fact that the company had a very specific set of needs and none of them really fit the bill.I guess next year he will reconsider vacationing with me for the summer.I have had many H-1B workers on my staff throughout the years and have had very good results. Is your company hiring more or fewer H-1B workers?


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Aug 28, 2009 5:18 AM debug debug  says:

All the h1-bs that I have worked for have fudged their resumes and are incompetent.  You get what you paid for.  If you pay for a 15 dollar an hour programmer you get a 15 dollar an hour programmer.   Sometimes we have to watch what we write, do you know you are causing an American to become unemployed.   With millions of Americans unemployed we don't need these visas.

I agree wholeheartedly. If you're even lucky enough to get one who can speak English properly, you'll find that almost every last one of them lie up and down the line on their resumes, claiming expertise in all sorts of things they haven't the first clue about.

I worked with one recently who, after 6 years of being a senior sysadmin, did not even know the basic tasks the servers were supposed to run.

And let's not even get into how racist so many of them are... against whites, against blacks, against orientals, and even against other Indians who aren't the same shade that they are!

My experience leads me to believe that 99% of H1-B visas are obtained by fraud. Very very few of them have even the skills they claim to have, forget about skills that can't be found among American workers.

As long as there is ONE qualified American without a job, there should be NO H-1B visas at all.

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Aug 31, 2009 2:58 AM Diego Diego  says: in response to Raj

You are a joke, you have a Indian Background, what do you father think about your comments.

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Aug 31, 2009 4:32 AM H1BGuy H1BGuy  says: in response to Raj

Look who is talking about H1B visas..First of all, learn the difference between 'crush' and 'crash', 'there' and 'their', 'this' and 'these'...Basically, go and learn ENGLISH first.Just, read your post once and you'll understand why you did not end up in a job.

Now coming to the facts, H1-B workers tend to work hard especially people where I hail from.When I first landed in my job I used to work for 12 hours a day.Not that I can't work, I had so much zeal in me to learn the business as soon as I can.Now I can proudly say that I'm equivalent to 3 AMERICAN workers in my company.Many people talk about fraud in resumes..I had several AMERICAN colleagues who boasts of several years of experience on their resume but never had any clue about what they are talking/referring to.May be foreigners are not very good at English (there's a difference between good and very good), but just remember that they are fluent in their mother tongue and are doing fairly decent with some other language.How many of you complaining here about their communication skills can do that. 

And do you really have complaints when somebody brings their family to USA.Dude, to bring a family here is not just a piece of cake.One has to spend several thousands of dollars before landing their family here which includes flight changes, visa charges, health insurance, food, and so on.And most importantly, they spend so much money on travel with the family.

Let me tell you something, 80% of the H1B workers do their Master's program in USA before trying for a job on H1B which means they have already invested around 40 grand which in some way boots the economy.

And, let's come to taxes.As somebody else here mentioned, there're no special tax laws for H1B workers.As an AMERICAN you may afford to stay here without job and without paying taxes.BUT, when you are on H1B you have to pay taxes ALL THE TIME, which means a H1B worker pays taxes as long as he stays here.

And now one most important issue which I hear people complaining about all the time."H1B workers don't have a clue about what they are talking/ H1B workers fake their resume".Okay, when you hire a H1B worker do any of you think that the company is obliged to keep him for a specific set of time?The answer is NO, if you are an American or any foreigner the company wants to get the job done.If you are not competent enough or not up to the mark a company always gets rid of you irrespective of your nationality.This holds true in my company where at least 10 AMERICANS got fired in the last 3 years and you know what I'm still here.There are several agencies which provide employment background checks and many companies use their services.So faking your resume is not in the scope of this issue.

No H1-B worker is taking a job from a qualified American.What does a company needs to do when they needs to hire somebody?Wait for the next few months without worrying about the fast approaching deadlines and business until they find an American OR hire a QUALIFIED H1-B worker once in while they come across.The interview process is same for everybody and no recruiter is lenient with a H1-B worker.In fact, based on my past experiences (and information from my HR department) sometimes they scrutinize a non-American just to make sure they are hiring a correct person.

So, after all this explanation any person with an ounce of brain can infer that no H1-B worker is taking a job away from a qualified American and is not doing any harm to American economy. Reply

Aug 31, 2009 4:32 AM H1BGuy H1BGuy  says: in response to Raj
If a H1B holder took your job then he's more competent, qualified and smarter than you.Any other reason given here is an excuse to cover your incompetency.So get a life and stop complaining about something that is not a problem at all.

Here're some statistics worth mentioning:There'll be 65000 H1B visas allowed every year and only 45,000 were used this year out of which around 10,000 will never show up or get denied or for other reason never use their H1B to work in USA.So, if you are good in Mathematics do some calculations and let everybody know how these 35,000 people are hurting American economy.

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Aug 31, 2009 4:35 AM Gonzalo Gonzalo  says: in response to Diego

As an Foreign Engineer, let me tell you that I studied 7 years (that is the curriculum) in a highly competitive university that is recognized in the world ranking as the No. 200. BTW, HP hired my brother because he is an Applied Math Engineer, do you think that HP does not know what they are doing? (He also got a 100% scholarship for his PhD in MIT).

You may believe that we do not study at all... but I had to do a final thesis and present it, just to be able to obtain my degree. I didn't have any "multiple choice" questions at all during my whole career, the shortest test was 3 hrs with only 3 questions. Finally, I ended up being hired in the U.S. as a common bachelor's degree of 4 years.

Taxes... everybody that works will know that the brackets are the same, if you pay more taxes is because you earned more money. There are no discrimination.

Helping the US economy? H1B Visas are expensive and all that money goes to the government (and lawyers).

A H1B is a NON-immigrant visa, so you can't live here forever, only for a certain period of time (1 to 3 years, renewable for 6 years MAX). You do require to eat, you do require to move (you will probably buy a car, I did), you will want to go out, have fun, enjoy your life... (I met my wife like that!) you are going to spend money, just like everybody else. And even more... Your driver license is only valid FOR A YEAR (1), unless you are a permanent resident, so every year you will have to renew your DL, that is more money for the US than regular citizens.

Health insurance, H1B does not require to pay for a health insurance. That's a company decision. Usually they do not pay for it, so if you get sick you pay FULL PRICE, non deductions at all. (Health care is very expensive!)

Credit Cards... If you are an alien, you will not have a Credit History, therefore, nobody is going to give you a credit card, so instead of buying things with credit cards, you will have to pay cash all the time until you have been long enough to enter into the system. If you live poorly, it may be because you get paid a low salary and you do not have credit!

We do not have a easy life. I am also not protecting illegal people, I do not agree with that. I am not saying that all visas are justified. What I am saying is that you must not generalize your judgement, at least without proofs or numbers (Even statistics can be fixed to show what you want). Is it worth it to live in the US? Well, I met my wife here, so for me it is. I fall in love with her and we are very happy, however, she found out that as an American, sometimes you take a lot of things for granted, while being an alien is way harder. Why do foreigners want to go back? Because their families are there, at least in Latin America your kids don't leave home at 18, they may even stay until they want to leave... is just another culture.

Regarding language, well I guess that your spanish, chinese, etc.. is not as good as your english. But if you go to Texas and talk to a 100% American, you may not understand everything... LOL. They are plenty of weird accents and words outside (just move from your state to another one and you will figure it out too).

As a market that is mainly based on Suppply and Demand, you will be out of it unless you drop your entry level price. However, remember that you will have to deliver quality or they will find someone else that will deliver both in a more attractive way ($_$)

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Aug 31, 2009 4:36 AM Gonzalo Gonzalo  says: in response to Diego

As an Foreign Engineer, let me tell you that I studied 7 years (that is the curriculum) in a highly competitive university that is recognized in the world ranking as the No.200.BTW, HP hired my brother because he is an Applied Math Engineer, do you think that HP does not know what they are doing?(He also got a 100% scholarship for his PhD in MIT).

You may believe that we do not study at all...but I had to do a final thesis and present it, just to be able to obtain my degree.I didn't have any "multiple choice" questions at all during my whole career, the shortest test was 3 hrs with only 3 questions.Finally, I ended up being hired in the U.S.as a common bachelor's degree of 4 years.

Taxes...everybody that works will know that the brackets are the same, if you pay more taxes is because you earned more money.There are no discrimination.

Helping the US economy?H1B Visas are expensive and all that money goes to the government (and lawyers).

A H1B is a NON-immigrant visa, so you can't live here forever, only for a certain period of time (1 to 3 years, renewable for 6 years MAX).You do require to eat, you do require to move (you will probably buy a car, I did), you will want to go out, have fun, enjoy your life...(I met my wife like that!) you are going to spend money, just like everybody else.And even more...Your driver license is only valid FOR A YEAR (1), unless you are a permanent resident, so every year you will have to renew your DL, that is more money for the US than regular citizens.

Health insurance, H1B does not require to pay for a health insurance.That's a company decision.Usually they do not pay for it, so if you get sick you pay FULL PRICE, non deductions at all.(Health care is very expensive!)

Credit Cards...If you are an alien, you will not have a Credit History, therefore, nobody is going to give you a credit card, so instead of buying things with credit cards, you will have to pay cash all the time until you have been long enough to enter into the system.If you live poorly, it may be because you get paid a low salary and you do not have credit!

We do not have a easy life.I am also not protecting illegal people, I do not agree with that.I am not saying that all visas are justified.What I am saying is that you must not generalize your judgement, at least without proofs or numbers (Even statistics can be fixed to show what you want).Is it worth it to live in the US?Well, I met my wife here, so for me it is.I fall in love with her and we are very happy, however, she found out that as an American, sometimes you take a lot of things for granted, while being an alien is way harder.Why do foreigners want to go back?Because their families are there, at least in Latin America your kids don't leave home at 18, they may even stay until they want to leave...is just another culture.

Regarding language, well I guess that your spanish, chinese, etc..is not as good as your english.But if you go to Texas and talk to a 100% American, you may not understand everything...LOL.They are plenty of weird accents and words outside (just move from your state to another one and you will figure it out too).

As a market that is mainly based on Suppply and Demand, you will be out of it unless you drop your entry level price.However, remember that you will have to deliver quality or they will find someone else that will deliver both in a more attractive way ($_$)

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Aug 31, 2009 5:00 AM Geradine D'Sa Geradine D'Sa  says: in response to raj sharma

To User1723893 the biggest jerk of all.

First - have the courage to identify yourself, and be professional. Raj has a name not Dude, but then that shows your true colors.

Your language and attitude shows where you are from - it is obvious you are one of those crash course experts who sneaked in just before Y2K and is now depriving hardworking professional Americans of their jobs.  

In the interest of space here is where you are completely wrong - 1) a crash course never covers for experience that an expert should have. False pretences of H1-B's is wrong. So you squeezed in a green card when demand was high and now many of you are or soon will be claiming unemployment. That is money stolen from American born.

2) Elderly parents/ and assumed surrogate relatives are falsely depleting scarce American resources. They claim social security without having paid a penny into the system. They claim Medicaid, food stamps, food pantry handouts, senior discounts for the family utilities etc. and deprive US born residents. And if your parents are dead you can always claim an aunt, uncle older brother or sister

3)Social and Medicare are running out of money because those who never contributed a penny are claiming large amounts. Even if they retire in India, they still get their social security and when they die in India, they don't tell the US government so their relatives still get paid. They exploit prepaid benefit cards long after their death because their relatives know the password.     

4)Yes, they don't pay their fair share of taxes because H1-Bs show minimum wage on the books and pay the rest in cash allowances. Many larger companies got caught by dept. of labor but there are others who change location, phone numbers etc and stay under the radar.   

5)They buy the foreclosures at pennies on the dollar so they do not contribute to the US economy. They are used to living in a dump, send kids to free public schools and rob more state resources.

What is wrong with people enjoying themselves at their own cost. Did you disclose why your wife cannot leave and is literally your slave because her parents were forced to give you their savings as a dowry in cash and gold. I know it is illegal but you know how to manipulate the authorities, and that is one of the many reasons you can't give your name.

I have the statistics, and when you have the courage to disclose your identity I will list/publicize the exact details of what you are guilty of.

Hope all you want!!! but NO ONE is jealous of scumbags like you and your posting proves it all. 

Fellow americans, join me in sending anonymous User1723893 back to the hole he came from. Go back and take care of your extended family with your Indian earnings, and stop stealing from the US government.

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Aug 31, 2009 5:29 AM Geradine D'Sa Geradine D'Sa  says: in response to Gonzalo

Gonzalo, I realize that you are part of the very few (less than 1%) of H1Bs that are educated and qualified to work in the US without displacing an American, as required on the application.

A few points you may not know - the tax brackets are the same for disclosed income. While reputable companies do no change the books, the small H1-B sponsor companies (that is all they do!!) pay literally less than half by check and most in untaxable cash. Then add the numerous dependants and deductions. They are also claiming benefits, even when they are not in the US. That is cheating the US government. More than 90% of the cost of H1Bs goes to the lawyers. Having worked at the with the treasury I have unearthed some of the scams.

Drivers license is just $10.

Health insurance is free health service and they cannot garnish your wages because you are not a resident.

Before the credit crisis credits was easy for everyone - which contributed to the crisis. Your credit limit is free money.

The market is Supply and demand and H1Bs from the special H1B shops have the advantage of lower disclosed earnings, and supplemental cash - rent subsidy, car loan payments, perdiem up to $35/day without receipt, gas upto $25/day without receipt ...all an unfair advantage. 

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Aug 31, 2009 6:07 AM Geradine D'Sa Geradine D'Sa  says: in response to H1BGuy

H1BGuy, you are a joke. When you comment on English communication watch your own writing. So let's start on your petty posting !!! -

...  several AMERICAN colleagues who boasts of several years of experience... or boast? forgot to drop the 's'?

What does a company needs to do when they needs to hire somebody?

...again an extra 's' for need is repeated, so the error is deliberate and not a type error.

All these ssss... and hissing. I can feel your attitude.

There is definite proof that H1Bs pay less taxes because they have a nontaxable cash component to compensation.

While you consider statistics, here is something for you to to chew on - If the H1B workers are sent away the US unemployment will drop over 3%.

Count the H1Bs for 6 years not just the last, and count their spouses who take temporary jobs that americans want and need in this economy.

The H1B is not smarter or more competent than the americans. The H1B appears to cost less, only because he pays less taxes, and in this economy, companies are counting their pennies. 

No country needs to support foreigners over their own citizens.

Background checks are only for US experience and education - fake all you want on foreign qualifications and experience.  Yes, the drop in H1Bs is because some of those initially approved are found to be fake.

This land belongs to Americans and H1Bs have no right to displace US born workers.

So get a life and go back to where you came from. 

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Aug 31, 2009 6:22 AM Geradine D'Sa Geradine D'Sa  says: in response to George Kovachev

To jerk user1078055

Still hiding ?

The spirit of the American dream has been tarnished by the greed of invading foreigners like user1078055 and the likes of him.

It is sad to see how the US has become the land of the free for those who don't belong here. The US has been too good to scavengers like you. Sure you have to work more hours, because you have to catch up on what pretended to know. Fudged resumes can come back to bite you.

So STOP criticizing its true citizens. You have no right to tell Americans what to do. Go back to your country and see if they will listen to you.

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Aug 31, 2009 7:01 AM raj sharma raj sharma  says: in response to Geradine D'Sa

Geraldine, i guess you might need a good lesson in American history. since you might have forgotten that America in itself has been a land of immigrants. The Immigrants who have come here from other countries, who intially come as H1, stay back to get their residency status/citizenships also start companies which in turn employ thousands of americans. What do you have to say to this ? Google, Sun ..there are hundreds of such companies started by these immigrants who are providing bread & butter to the americans.

This is the land of opportunity.

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Aug 31, 2009 7:45 AM Geradine D'Sa Geradine D'Sa  says: in response to raj sharma

Ralph DeFrangesco aka user1723893

As I stated before, the american dream has been killed by the opportunists gangs, who grab resources for themselves and their relatives and step on any american that happens to be in their way. I am well aware of the 230 year history of the US, and how the recent introduction of H1Bs has tarnished tradition. You forget to mention the hordes of unqualified H-4s connected with H1Bs. They take away much more value than they bring, and are never evaluated.

There is a huge difference between the corporations you mention, and the small H1B outfits who only make money from the price differential of importing and placing H1Bs - those who make profits from manipulating resumes, tax and immigraion laws .... any unscruplous method to make profits.

In this economy  I agree with Timothy, Raj and Debug - HIRE AMERICANS.

Yes, this is a land of opportunity but NOT at the expense of american born citizens.

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Aug 31, 2009 10:21 AM Ralph DeFrangesco Ralph DeFrangesco  says:

First, I would like to thank all of you for taking the time to share your thoughts about my post. There is obviously a lot of passion about this subject. I am not going to try and change anyone's mind about how they feel. I would just like to point out that we need to respect each other's opinion and not make this personal. We learn nothing by insulting each other. If you really want to make your point, please include a reputable link to facts that back up your statements. We can debate facts and even opinions, but we are professionals and insults don't belong here.

Thank you,

-Ralph

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Aug 31, 2009 11:23 AM Diego Diego  says: in response to debug

That is your personal experience, i'm a H1-B worker and i'm doing the work of 3 persons (and better, by the way those 3 were Americans), the problem with people like you is, you think you are better because of your race, but is not True.

The brain is not in the language, i hope you get a better job.

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Aug 31, 2009 11:26 AM Timothy Horrigan Timothy Horrigan  says:

I don't necessarily agree with everything the first commenter said, but I do agree with his basic point: HIRE AMERICANS!

There are millions of well-qualified unemployed Americans (not to mention legal immigrants who already have work permits.)  It is insane that we are handing out so many H-1B visas when our own people are starving. 

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Aug 31, 2009 11:53 AM Raj Raj  says: in response to debug

I agree with you 100%. My background is an Indian but I was born and went to school here in USA. All most all of H1-B visas are obtained by fraud. I know that for fact, because so many of them told me so. Most of them take a week of crush courses and they become expert.

This H1-B visa also have other problem beside taking job away from qualified American. Most of these candidate stay back and bringing there family to USA. They bring there elderly parents who do not have health insurance and they wide up in the emergency room for healthcare needs.

The other problem is that these people do not pay much tax or spend there money in USA. They live very very cheap and save all the money and send to India. So these people are not contributing to USA economy at all.

In order to reduce H1-B visa, IT Company's should stop working with Indian owned IT Recruiting company. Almost all of the Indian owned IT recruiting company are involve in this fraud.

We need raise this points to USA media and government to show how our qualified America are without job and these frauds are taking the job away from us.

I will repeat:  As long as there is ONE qualified American without a job, there should be NO NO NO H-1B visas at all.

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Aug 31, 2009 12:00 PM Eric Hochstein Eric Hochstein  says:

Some companies that have had problems getting the H1B visas that they required in the US have found a good alternative by establishing "captive" operations in Canada, where the immigration standards are more oriented to meeting the needs of businesses.  Microsoft is one good example of this.

blogs.eweek.com/careers/content001/outsourcing/hiring_frenzy_for_microsoft_vancouver.html

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Aug 31, 2009 12:33 PM raj sharma raj sharma  says: in response to Raj

Dude ..i think you should verify you facts completely before stating them in a forum like this. Can't believe such comments coming from a Indian itself. Yes! i am an indian myself & came to this country 12 years back on an H1B. Here is the clarification..

- Well..i partially agree to this statement that some of them (& not most of them as you mentioned) do take crash courses to become an expert. So tell me what's wrong in that ...they spend their time & money to do this because they are motivated to learn. These guys then spend hundreds of hours of their own time working late to learn the concepts & gain expertise...whereas a local american would rather spend his free time at a beach or at party boozing & oogling at girls. Which company in US will pay any person who does not know his stuff ..if these guys are getting paid then it means they are delivering stuff.

- Why do you have a problem if they bring their family & elderly parents to US ? Why do you care if they wind up in emergency rooms ...its not as if they are getting free treatment ...they do end up footing most part of the bill just like anyone out here. Anyways you will not get what it means to have a family since you will not have one for yourself...your parents will end up dieing alone at some retirement home & which you wouldn't care bcos you'll have the same fate when you grow old.

- Youmentioned they don't pay much taxes? Dude which world are you living ? If they get paid ..they invariably have to pay taxes like any other common man who lives here. There is no special provision for H1 to get away from taxes. And you know what ...many of them go back to India after having lived here & having paid Social Security which you local guys will eventually get when you retire.

- When they live here they pay their rent ..buy houses ( which do not end up in foreclosure like many local people do) ...spend on kids ...food....clothes etc So tell me how are they not contributing to the local US economy. Yes! they do send money to india ..but that's their saving ..which you will not understand because you would have spent that money busy partying & drinking.

Dude ...no one is perfect ..like there are good guys there will be bad guys too ..so don't just generalise ..knows your facts before stating them.

I guess you must be feeling so very jealous now ...right ?

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Aug 31, 2009 12:42 PM Brian B Brian B  says: in response to Raj

I have worked as a CIO and as an independent consultant.  For most IT jobs there is not a shortage of qualified candidates - it is the cost/price that is an issue.  Bringing in more H1Bs is an artificial way to reduce price which is driven by business owners. 

Regarding fraud - I have seen this in so many ways.  From using the L-1 training visa to do actual work when H1B visas dried up, paying far below rate wages (but the consulting company is paid normal rates or just below), having H1Bs come over and then look for more work.  Put a posting out on any job board for a Java programmer, C# or other basic skill and see how many H1Bs respond directly.  If you try to hire them better make sure someone tests thier knowledge.

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Aug 31, 2009 12:55 PM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says:

Ultimately, it is a matter of need. Of course, the Americans in this forum represent their interest: DON'T HIRE FOREIGNERS, PAY US MORE!!!

Well, guys, don't forget that it is your bosses who outsource you to India and China and hire H1-B workers.

   My advice to you: if you wanna get paid more, START YOUR OWN COMPANIES AND STOP COMPLAINING. Then you will have one chance you never had in life - TO PAY YOURSELF. Of course, you will have to to all the heavy lifting, haha. And when you try to reduce your expenses, guess what you are gonna do? Outsource, hire disadvantaged H1-B workers who are tied to you ONLY and cannot get another job.

The foreigners represent their point of view: they work for 3 American employees, 14-16 hours a day, and always take the blame for their American bosses unreasonable ambitions and badly planned projects. However, that is better for them compared to what they get it their countries. That's why they are in the US.

This country used be beacon of hope for everybody. What happened to that spirit? I guess it was tarnished by greed.

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Sep 1, 2009 2:17 AM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says: in response to Geradine D'Sa

technologyManagementConsultantGeradine,

Nobody is hiding from you. You don't look nearly as scary as you think you are.

Browbeating is not going to help you, bully!!! Calling me a jerk is not going to help you either. Now you will get the response that you actually deserve.

Firstly, I am an European. I speak six different languages fluently: English, French, German, Bulgarian, Russian, and Macedonian. HOW MANY LANGUAGES DO YOU SPEAK FLUENTLY??? ENGLISH AND BAD ENGLISH???

   I also hold three degrees: a Bachelor in International Business, an Associate in Computer Science, and a Master of Science in IT (majoring in computer information systems, or CIS as it is commonly known), and I am well on my way to earn an MBA from McGill. HOW MANY DEGREES DO YOU HOLD???

Secondly, calling foreigners greedy is just ridiculous. If you haven't noticed the foreigners are the ones toiling under your boot for half the money that you make by claiming credit for what they actually deliver to you.

Thirdly, the only true citizens, if you go back in time, are the native American Indians whose land your ancestors took away, remember? So don't even talk about true citizenship.

Fourthly, YOUR COUNTRY WAS BUILT BY IMMIGRANTS!!! The Chinese built your railroads. Yes, they are made with rice and water.

   Nikola Tesla created everything electric and lit up New York by harnessing the power of the Niagara Falls through his inventions. Albert Einstein, originally a German citizen, gave you the  Theory of Relativity, and later the atomic bomb, which allowed you to win so easily in Japan during the Second World War.

   More than 60% of your scientific community is composed of foreigners, people whom you consider inferior to you because you are so arrogant.

Lastly, I know your history much better than you know it - from the ideals of the founding fathers like George Washington, John Quincy Adams and Thomas Jefferson to the policies of JFK, Lyndon Johnson, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Regan, Bill Clinton, and Barak Husein Obama.

   I know your constitution quite well, too. Its first amendment guarantees freedom of speech to the general populace. So if you are a TRUE CITIZEN, the way you so boastfully declare, RESPECT THE VERY PRINCIPLES ON WHICH YOUR REPUBLIC RESTS, FREEDOM OF SPEECH BEING THE MOST IMPORTANT ONE!!! DON'T TELL OTHERS NOT TO CRITICIZE YOU BECAUSE THEY HAVE EVERY RIGHT, ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY EARN THEIR LIVING BY THE SWEAT OF THEIR BROW!!!

A note  on H1-Bs - if an H1-B worker gets laid off he or she has no right to social security and has only 30 days to find another sponsor (close to impossible) or leave the country. I bet you would not like to be treated this way if you worked in another country, right?

I hope the response was eloquent enough for you. After all, you deserve proper argumentation - I know how much you guys like going to court in the US.

    Perhaps, with time you will start to respect the people who come to your shores and do most of the heavy lifting for you, or perhaps you will keep your narrow views and consider other nations inferior, who knows.

Oh, by the way, I do not live in the US after I earned my Master of Science in IT degree in Boston - it was 34K just for the tuition and I earned and paid every penny myself working 16 hours a day before I started the degree.

    I live in Canada - you know that nice green country up North that respects you for your hard work and gives you a green card in 6 to 12 months, ha ha.

There will be no further replies to your responses, if any. My time is really valuable and gave you more than enough of it!

Reply
Sep 1, 2009 2:18 AM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says: in response to Geradine D'Sa

technologyManagementConsultantGeradine,

Nobody is hiding from you.You don't look nearly as scary as you think you are.

Browbeating is not going to help you, bully!!!Calling me a jerk is not going to help you either.Now you will get the response that you actually deserve.

Firstly, I am an European.I speak six different languages fluently:English, French, German, Bulgarian, Russian, and Macedonian.HOW MANY LANGUAGES DO YOU SPEAK FLUENTLY???ENGLISH AND BAD ENGLISH???

  I also hold three degrees:a Bachelor in International Business, an Associate in Computer Science, and a Master of Science in IT (majoring in computer information systems, or CIS as it is commonly known), and I am well on my way to earn an MBA from McGill.HOW MANY DEGREES DO YOU HOLD???

Secondly, calling foreigners greedy is just ridiculous.If you haven't noticed the foreigners are the ones toiling under your boot for half the money that you make by claiming credit for what they actually deliver to you.

Thirdly, the only true citizens, if you go back in time, are the native American Indians whose land your ancestors took away, remember?So don't even talk about true citizenship.

Fourthly, YOUR COUNTRY WAS BUILT BY IMMIGRANTS!!!The Chinese built your railroads.Yes, they are made with rice and water.

  Nikola Tesla created everything electric and lit up New York by harnessing the power of the Niagara Falls through his inventions.Albert Einstein, originally a German citizen, gave you the Theory of Relativity, and later the atomic bomb, which allowed you to win so easily in Japan during the Second World War.

  More than 60% of your scientific community is composed of foreigners, people whom you consider inferior to you because you are so arrogant.

Lastly, I know your history much better than you know it - from the ideals of the founding fathers like George Washington, John Quincy Adams and Thomas Jefferson to the policies of JFK, Lyndon Johnson, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Regan, Bill Clinton, and Barak Husein Obama.

  I know your constitution quite well, too.Its first amendment guarantees freedom of speech to the general populace.So if you are a TRUE CITIZEN, the way you so boastfully declare, RESPECT THE VERY PRINCIPLES ON WHICH YOUR REPUBLIC RESTS, FREEDOM OF SPEECH BEING THE MOST IMPORTANT ONE!!!DON'T TELL OTHERS NOT TO CRITICIZE YOU BECAUSE THEY HAVE EVERY RIGHT, ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY EARN THEIR LIVING BY THE SWEAT OF THEIR BROW!!!

A note on H1-Bs - if an H1-B worker gets laid off he or she has no right to social security and has only 30 days to find another sponsor (close to impossible) or leave the country.I bet you would not like to be treated this way if you worked in another country, right?

I hope the response was eloquent enough for you.After all, you deserve proper argumentation - I know how much you guys like going to court in the US.

   Perhaps, with time you will start to respect the people who come to your shores and do most of the heavy lifting for you, or perhaps you will keep your narrow views and consider other nations inferior, who knows.

Oh, by the way, I do not live in the US after I earned my Master of Science in IT degree in Boston - it was 34K just for the tuition and I earned and paid every penny myself working 16 hours a day before I started the degree.

    Reply

Sep 1, 2009 2:18 AM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says: in response to Geradine D'Sa
I live in Canada - you know that nice green country up North that respects you for your hard work and gives you a green card in 6 to 12 months, ha ha.

There will be no further replies to your responses, if any.My time is really valuable and gave you more than enough of it!

Reply
Sep 1, 2009 2:22 AM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says: in response to Brian B

Very aptly said. However, you don't  question the fact that you can get a relatively more qualified candidate for less money if that person is a foreigner hired on an H1-B, right?

Example:

I graduated in the top 2% of my class in Boston from a very prestigious school. I had 4 years of Java experience under my belt before I started working as a senior Java developer in California for 42K per year.

My American counterparts with lower GPAs and 2 years of Java experience started at 65K to 70K per year.

Do you see my point.

Reply
Sep 1, 2009 2:40 AM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says: in response to Raj

I don't know where you get your information but all of my grad fellow students who are foreigners got their first H1-Bs after graduation.

Incidentally, I know many Chinese IT professionals in California who are with Master and PhD degrees because I was invited to their graduation.

If you are talking about the first IT workers who came around 1995-97 from Ireland, yeah, I hear you. They got off easy - just took some basic courses in C and C++ in a community college and companies lined up to give them 60K+ per year for that. There were simply very few programmers back then. I personally know 4 Irish guys from South Boston who got their green cards in 1999 like that.

Cut the politics and spit out the cat: foreigners just force you to stay on edge and earn your money like everyone else. No foreigner will be hired instead of you if he or she were not at least 3 times better.

Wake up and see the facts. IT is difficult, fast pace field and there is more than enough work in it if you are ready to work hard. So roll up your sleeves and get down to business. Trust me, you will enjoy it.

Reply
Sep 1, 2009 10:56 AM jayaprakash upparlapalli jayaprakash upparlapalli  says: in response to Raj

search you soul before blaming others. your parents did the same. How could you be a born American had your parents not migrated to USA on some pretext or the other. And, be grateful that the whole America is able to survive on the immigrant labor - whether legal or illegal - from Asia, Mexico, and other countries. This country owes a lot to the mexicans and the unfortunate class of Americans than to people like you. Your language and expressions speak how so poorly qualified you are in the very native language that is spoken and written all through your life. Get educated first and then comment, my dear!

Reply
Sep 1, 2009 11:57 AM Diego Diego  says: in response to Gonzalo

I think you are missing something, i'm a H1B Worker and have more than 9 years of experience plus 4 in college, and i'm here because a company call me, but i was making a comment to RAJ.

Reply
Sep 1, 2009 12:07 PM Diego Diego  says: in response to George Kovachev

like user1078055 said "foreigners just force you to stay on edge and earn your money like everyone else. No foreigner will be hired instead of you if he or she were not at least 3 times better."

So "technologyManagementConsultantGeradine", try to see the big picture, Google, Sun they see the big picture that's why they are big, you dont.

Reply
Sep 2, 2009 1:22 AM Patrick Avery Patrick Avery  says: in response to TechnologyManagementConsultant

Feel free to continue this conversation in our discussion thread. www.itbusinessedge.com/cm/message/1718

Reply
Sep 2, 2009 1:35 AM George Kovachev George Kovachev  says: in response to TechnologyManagementConsultant

Your ignorance is as deep as your prejudiced attack on all immigrants in the forum. Your conclusions are wrong and irrelevant. You have no respect for other nations and you should expect the same in return.

Rest in piece, bully! You cannot deceive the people in this forum with your narrow views.

As to your assumptions on the green card I can only say this:

I was offered a green card 4 times while in the US, both in Boston and in San Francisco. However, I decided to accept a management position in the European Parliament in Belgium, something the likes of you can only dream of. You need to have lived in those countries to be accepted at that level of work. Big-mouth consultants like you just don't cut it.

You cannot fool people as to the number of languages you speak. It is very evident from you poor native phraseology that you cannot properly even speak your own language. I don't know how that No.1 institution that you do NOT mention in your post gave you the degree but you really have way to go to earn it.

And finally, I can post here as many times as I want. You see, that's why it is the "Land of the Free" - I am free to post against the wishes of bigots and bullies like you. If your blood pressure is going up, then I am really happy about it :).

Here is a little line that explains why I am not in your "Holy Grail" country:

MY COUNTRY IS THE WORLD AND MY RELIGION IS TO DO GOOD!!!

Have a nice day

Reply
Sep 2, 2009 4:27 AM Geradine D'Sa Geradine D'Sa  says: in response to George Kovachev

Another ridiculous post from you!! ol' Boston user. When did Boston MA become a part of your Canada?

Just wondering whether "rest in piece" is Belgium phraseology or from some other country. In the world I know, it is "rest in peace". Of course, all your curses are useless - I am still alive and my blood pressure is fine.

As for "from you poor native phraseology" - looks like you are the native because it should be "your" in all english, except your bad english.  

Call me anything, because your words mean nothing, except to show your origins, class and beliefs.

Post as much as you like. We all enjoy seeing you upset.  I thought you did not have the time, but obviously you have nothing better to do than attack others with false statements.

Here is the ranking rankings.ft.com/businessschoolrankings/global-mba-rankings-2008

Wharton is on the top, Booth is 7th and McGill is 96th. We stay away from Parliaments and politicians for obvious reasons.

Your country is not the world, because it does not include the US and you live to slander everyone outside your world. At least check your statements for accuracy.

Your "bad english" is hilarious so keep writing. We all look forward to your next outburst!!!

Reply
Sep 2, 2009 12:58 PM TechnologyManagementConsultant TechnologyManagementConsultant  says: in response to George Kovachev

To user1078055, of Boston MA not Canada on this site.

 

Your post is a waste of my time, and you don't deserve any response.

However, I want to alert the other readers to how much your rambling stinks of your personal frustration at not being able to remain in the US.

Check your facts before you boast that you are smarter than the other readers - you are wrong. You also need classes on WWII, social economics... besides several more degrees.

I am better educated than you, already have an MBA from the No1 ranked Business School, an MS in Computer Technology and 3 other masters degrees (all with fellowship awards). I speak read and write 6 languages, besides English. I have heard 'Bad English' in Macedonia, Serbia, the former USSR and the Czech Republic and seen bad spelling - 'Barak Husein Obama' in your post for starters.

While not of your european origin, I have travelled and worked around the world and I am priviledged to have many distinguished friends and colleagues. Many have senior positions, got their well deserved green card in less than a year and I respect their achievements.

As an earlier immigrant, from the last century, I respect the advantages of the US, including free speech and equal rights. I cannot stand the complaining likes of you, or the recent influx of incompetent opportunitists who only asset is their ego. You get what you deserve, including scholarships. Hopefully, the MBA might teach you the value of different levels of work . Obviously your grades were not good enough for a tuition waiver. Those who can't survive in the US (laid off from your java job in CA??) end up in Canada so enjoy yourself up north. 

Don't waste your valuable time replying - the readers already know you.

Reply

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